Shinjin - Hai.

[Shinjin]

Hai, everyone, well uhhm, here goes:

I am Shinjin (I like chinese, japanese sounding names), I am 23 years of age, male, that lives in The Netherlands.

I am currently not tied to a belief system of any sorts, as it's hard to explain my situation, but I will try anyways;

When I was 14 - 15, I once read a book that was a loosely based children's book on Wicca. It explained about elements, your inner castle, how to empower yourself with confidence, and about the seasons.

This sparked my interest, and it soon lead me to the internet, and several other books. I read those, it sounded cool, it was better than anything I read before. I could do magick, and attune myself with an god and goddess. I was never a believer in anything, and this sparked my interest.

So I dabbled in it, read a lot of books, and in the meantime my home situation deteriorated. Constant problems, and household violence. I ended up going into several other houses throughout the years, to be my own person, without those problems.

I prayed to the god and goddess for comfort at times, there wasn't much to do, had minimal internet access. I am now 23 and I left those times behind me, the interest left me for a bit, and I met some rough times still...

I have concluded it's hard for me to believe, even though I do want to believe there's more. I think this is a fundamental problem, since I do sometimes pray for signs, or guidance. Sometimes I see signs I think, but then I pray and get no confirmation.

I am now wandering, not liking life to much, but not hating it either. Got a lovely fiance, and she has a kid which I've been there for since before he was born. I love him as my own, my little hump of loving.

I just miss something.

Anyways, this is me right now, sorry for the long post.

Thanks for reading.

Blessed Be.

[Spiral Arms]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Welcome...as a skeptic, I understand your finding it hard to believe. I've been through some scary fucked up shit too, and it's caused me to question everything.

[Jembru]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Welcome to the forum Shinjin! I too can sympathise with your scepticism. I'm sure with time, research and much thought, you'll start to find a belief system that works for you. Our members have such a wide range of beliefs, knowledge and experience that the discussions here are probably as good a place as any to start.

Erm.. I'm ashamed to admit this but I actually thought 'Sjin of the yogcast' before I thought 'Japanese' when I saw your name. As Pagan Forum's resident Japanese speaker, I think this shows the depth of my yogscast obsession. Gods help me...

[anubisa]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Welcome to the forum!

[Shinjin]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Thanks everyone for the warm welcome.

A question arises with my skepticism:

Is it okay to adhere to a belief system even though you are so skeptic of everything?

I mean there's so many things that apply to me, yet it feels like it's a crime when I am that skeptic of it.

[Spiral Arms]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Belief doesn't necessarily require dogma. You can believe something while still being openminded enough to evaluate that belief and change it if it proves to be wrong or harmful. Don't we all do that with other non-spiritual beliefs we have anyways?

[Shinjin]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Yeah but take this for an example:

I know a christian which for his whole life has been raised to go to the church on Sundays as a minimum, and sometimes even more times a week to just pray. Now he was raised with a certain dogma, that if ignored would make him a sinner. I don't know the specifics, but it ultimately means he was a sinner and should repent, when he didn't pray.

Now he doesn't go to church, or pray as often. In that case I agree, he still believes, but he loosened him enforcing his dogma.

What I mean is, I don't have a dogma, I don't have a belief system, due to the fact it's just hard to belief, without personal affirmation that it's "there" and "true".

I get your point though, and might not need to fret it much or as much.

[thalassa]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Is it okay to adhere to a belief system even though you are so skeptic of everything?

The Unitarian Universalist had a PSA that said "When in doubt, Pray. When in prayer, Doubt."

IMO: belief without reflection and faith without doubt are hubris

[Jembru]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

You may well stumble upon posts of mine from a few years up to a few months ago, in which you'll see snippits of the process, but I went through similar feelings. I was a dedicated pagan for many years, but having watched people I love go through real hardships (and having a few setbacks myself), I stopped trusting the gods. I prayed, I cast spells, I meditated, yet nothing would make the suffering stop. Initially I walked away from my faith altogether, then I realised I need something spiritual in my life. It's in my psychological makeup. So for the last year or so, I've been dipping back in. It took very little to make me relapse into dispair and anger at the gods though. News stories especially triggered those feelings.

I couldn't have faith in, or care for, any deity that either didn't care enough, or wasn't able, to step in and stop the suffering of innocent people and creatures. It seemed to affect my mental health and I started having panic attacks, although I suspect there was much more involved than just my sense of abandoment and anger at my gods.

Over time and in very small steps, I gradually found a theology that allows me to reconcile these feelings. Once I had that, I was able to build a system of religious, spiritual and magical practice around that. I'm quite content for now, although it's early days. It was hard and emotionally draining. I cried a lot.. often publicly on this forum. But I got there because I felt I HAD to find something, so couldn't give up.

This of course, is the long version of what I was saying in my first post! ^^

[Shinjin]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Thanks for sharing that Jembru, and thanks for the insight Thalassa.

That's rough, Jembru. You went through a lot, but you come back, each time a bit stronger.

I will begin to do prayer regularly I think at first, just to throw my heart out there.

A loving thanks from some new random stranger!

[gelman66]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

If you have belief without doubt or skepticism then that belief is not fully formed or has not matured. Life constantly challenges faith and yet we as human want to believe in something that is greater than ourselves. We strive for purpose and order in our lives, to understand, to believe

No person is immune from suffering and no belief can save you from suffering in my opinion. All we can ask is that belief makes the suffering and hardship more tolerable. Buddhists believe that suffering stems from desire and only by conquering our ego can we be free of suffering. Its easy to say but very difficult to live.


What I do is that no worthwhile faith provides easy answers, but its better and more worthwhile to live with a spiritual practice than to live without one.

[Shinjin]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

So believing while constantly questioning what you believe is part of believing, thus thoroughly acceptable.

To come to think that mere words hold so much significance.

I do not need to want instant affirmation, doubting is part of belief, without it, belief has little meaning or less meaning?

I do understand hardships are there to mold your experiences, and add to it, make you stronger.

Thanks for all of your insights, it's been a pleasant exchange.

[gelman66]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Yes, I think that's right. No thinking person can have belief without doubt. True belief does not exist without doubt.

Do the hardships exist to make us stronger? I don't know about that. I really don't know if the hardships have meaning or if they do, they are only meaningful to us.

[Shinjin]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

Sounds fair, but don't you think believing the hardships are intended to mold us, make us stronger:

Makes it a little easier to bare, than just believing it to be there, just because it's there?

[gelman66]

Re: Shinjin - Hai.

I'm not convinced that the hardships exist to strengthen us.

How do the hardships make us stronger? Is this universally true? Some people just end up broken by them or forever changed by them - and not in a positive way.

For me it comes to choice what we choose to do and how we choose to respond to whatever we are faced with and faith helps to affirm life and turn away from death and despair.