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Thread: An Atheistic World

  1. #11

    Re: An Atheistic World

    Quote Originally Posted by thalassa View Post
    pretty much this^ and this:



    Religion is an EXCUSE not a REASON....which is a bit like the difference between correlation and causation.

    Athiests are just as dumb as theists when it comes to the stupid things that people believe in. Atheists don't have the market on intelligence, or even reason and logic cornered when it comes to any topic in general, or the existence of "god" in particular. That would be confusing them with the people that truly have the only defendable intellectual, science-based position on whether or not "god" exists...and those people would be agnostics.
    I can agree with this notion that ones I.Q isn't automatically raised by choosing to be atheist. We can be pretty stupid ourselves and I'll own it. The thing that I'd like to point out though is that agnosticism and atheism seem to answer two separate questions dealing with what you know and what you believe.

    For the reason that I DONT know everything I'm agnostic. In light of not knowing plus the fact that I don't yet see any evidence for any particular deity I'm atheist (keyword "yet"). Could there possibly be something to these claims of Gods and Goddesses though? There could be who knows...I just feel much research is needed. Not claiming to be smarter then anyone in saying that just expressing my own thoughts.

    In a sense I do feel drawn to certain Pagan ideas though, won't lie. It definitely rings my interests and certainly seems to resonates far better within me. Though at this point, because there's still so much to learn, I choose to be skeptical.

    And to answer the question:

    It probably won't immediately become a utopia right off the bat if that's what you're wondering. In truth, I think it'd be better to simply acknowledge the fact that not every one is or should be an exact cookie cutter of one another. It seems people will always have their differences. I think we're all capable of bringing about that kinda change regardless of belief. Cause like it or not, we all inhabit the same tiny blue speck adrift this amazing cosmos full of mystery and wonder.

    peace

  2. #12
    Nihilistic Goddess Medusa's Avatar
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Unless every atheists removes their own political agenda, this world will still suck.
    We may not believe in deity, but we pretty much believe in a lot of dumb things.

    Global warming or lack of it, chemtrails (whatever you think they are), abortion rights or non rights, how to raise children, vegans....the world without religion is still stock full of dummies.
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    Member Spiral Arms's Avatar
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    You can remove religion entirely and yet other elements of tribalism, racism, sexism etc. would still exist.

    However they wouldn't be able to rest on the "god said it, that settles it" arguments that has caused so much idiocy to come into our politics in this country.

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    Re: An Atheistic World

    There will be always some good and bad in everything. In both worlds - with and without religion. So it doesn't matter.
    "Fair means that everybody gets what they need. And the only way to get that is to make it happen yourself."



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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Actually, it does matter. Religion by its very nature precludes critical thinking. It requires faith over reason. Feeling over substance. All is fine when you separate both from science, politics, and real issues but when it dictates policy, causes people to fly planes into buildings, create war, and is basis for prejudice there is a problem and it does matter.

    Make the argument that things would be no different without religion-that war, death, and bad things would happen at the same rate but in actuality they wouldn't. Religion regards our progress. Try to get anyone but a Christian to win a presidential election. Try to find equal rights as a woman in Saudi Arabia. I wonder where the Catholic Churches death toll stands?

    People will still be people and still have all their failings but let's not pretend religion has not had a profound negative affect on this.

  6. #16
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Lol. Wut?
    You think religion causes people to lose the capacity for critical thinking? Holy hell man. WE (everyone) are not the best at critical thinking. Ever wonder why people still do this day can't figure out that if you stick your weiner in a lady hole, a baby may pop out 9 months later? Ever wonder why we pick up a piece of food off the floor and count to 5 before we eat it? Ever wonder why we keep going back to the same person, even when they abuse us, thinking this time will be different? Ever wonder why we think it's perfectly ok to go out wearing white pants on your menstrual cycle? Why some men think yeah, if I cat call this chic on the street she will totally go out with me!

    Critical thinking my ass. We are dum dums. Through and through. Take away religion and we are still that same dum dum. With just one less scape goat to blame for our lack of critical thinking.
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaganMafia View Post
    Actually, it does matter. Religion by its very nature precludes critical thinking. It requires faith over reason. Feeling over substance. All is fine when you separate both from science, politics, and real issues but when it dictates policy, causes people to fly planes into buildings, create war, and is basis for prejudice there is a problem and it does matter.

    Make the argument that things would be no different without religion-that war, death, and bad things would happen at the same rate but in actuality they wouldn't. Religion regards our progress. Try to get anyone but a Christian to win a presidential election. Try to find equal rights as a woman in Saudi Arabia. I wonder where the Catholic Churches death toll stands?

    People will still be people and still have all their failings but let's not pretend religion has not had a profound negative affect on this.
    Then you didn't do enough research, TPM. The Pope of Vatican for instance, since you mentioned Christianity, has a Chemistry degree. How many religious Jews there are who won Nobel Prizes... There was a Muslim who won a Nobel Prize. My physics teacher has a second degree and is religious. He's an awesome person.
    Try reading more about the subject. Many pagans view both science and religion alike. I said it earlier in other threads and am saying it again - religion and christianity are two sides of the different coin.

    Of course, religion much depends on the people believing in it. That's why we have terrorists all over the world. But like I mentioned earlier, religious people can be people of science as well.
    "Fair means that everybody gets what they need. And the only way to get that is to make it happen yourself."



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  8. #18
    sea witch thalassa's Avatar
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    ...and without religion, there would be no debate here over all of this, because there would be no internet, because there would be no computers, because there would be no electricity, because there would be no inquiry into magnetism, because there would be no alchemy, because there would be no magic, because there would be no interaction with spirits...

    And we, as a species, having never tapped into the unseen world around us as a form of bonding beyond family and tribe, would still be nomadic tribesmen wandering the earth warring over who gets first dibs at the watering hole.



    (I've been watching WAY too much "How we got to now")
    “You have never answered but you did not need to. If I stand at the ocean I can hear you with your thousand voices. Sometimes you shout, hilarious laughter that taunts all questions. Other nights you are silent as death, a mirror in which the stars show themselves. Then I think you want to tell me something, but you never do. Of course I know I have written letters to no-one. But what if I find a trident tomorrow?" ~~Letters to Poseidon, Cees Nooteboom

    “We still carry this primal relationship to the Earth within our consciousness, even if we have long forgotten it. It is a primal recognition of the wonder, beauty, and divine nature of the Earth. It is a felt reverence for all that exists. Once we bring this foundational quality into our consciousness, we will be able to respond to our present man-made crisis from a place of balance, in which our actions will be grounded in an attitude of respect for all of life. This is the nature of real sustainability.”
    ~~Llewellyn Vaughan-Lee

    "We are the offspring of history, and must establish our own paths in this most diverse and interesting of conceivable universes--one indifferent to our suffering, and therefore offering us maximal freedom to thrive, or to fail, in our own chosen way."
    ~~Stephen Jay Gould, Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History

    "Humans are not rational creatures. Now, logic and rationality are very helpful tools, but there’s also a place for embracing our subjectivity and thinking symbolically. Sometimes what our so-called higher thinking can’t or won’t see, our older, more primitive intuition will." John Beckett

    Pagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible

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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Yes, religion does cause people to.lose their capacity for critical thinking. When faith causes you to reject facts that is a failure of critical thinking. But, I believe I also said that people would still be people with all their failings. I never said religion was the one cause of stupidity I said religion is a magnifier of this.

    Religion held its purpose when we were nomadic tribesman wandering the Earth and couldn't figure out where lightning or earthquakes came from. Religion, was indeed the catalyst of civilization. But, then we also didn't know where lightning or earthquakes came from.

  10. #20
    sea witch thalassa's Avatar
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    Re: An Atheistic World

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaganMafia View Post
    Religion held its purpose when we were nomadic tribesman wandering the Earth and couldn't figure out where lightning or earthquakes came from. Religion, was indeed the catalyst of civilization. But, then we also didn't know where lightning or earthquakes came from.

    And religion still has purpose, else there would no longer be religion. You may not agree with that purpose, but that doesn't negate it.

    If for no other reason that there are still places on earth that don't know where lightning and earthquakes and (rain and disease) come from.

    And science has been responsible for plenty of stupidity.
    “You have never answered but you did not need to. If I stand at the ocean I can hear you with your thousand voices. Sometimes you shout, hilarious laughter that taunts all questions. Other nights you are silent as death, a mirror in which the stars show themselves. Then I think you want to tell me something, but you never do. Of course I know I have written letters to no-one. But what if I find a trident tomorrow?" ~~Letters to Poseidon, Cees Nooteboom

    “We still carry this primal relationship to the Earth within our consciousness, even if we have long forgotten it. It is a primal recognition of the wonder, beauty, and divine nature of the Earth. It is a felt reverence for all that exists. Once we bring this foundational quality into our consciousness, we will be able to respond to our present man-made crisis from a place of balance, in which our actions will be grounded in an attitude of respect for all of life. This is the nature of real sustainability.”
    ~~Llewellyn Vaughan-Lee

    "We are the offspring of history, and must establish our own paths in this most diverse and interesting of conceivable universes--one indifferent to our suffering, and therefore offering us maximal freedom to thrive, or to fail, in our own chosen way."
    ~~Stephen Jay Gould, Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History

    "Humans are not rational creatures. Now, logic and rationality are very helpful tools, but there’s also a place for embracing our subjectivity and thinking symbolically. Sometimes what our so-called higher thinking can’t or won’t see, our older, more primitive intuition will." John Beckett

    Pagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible

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