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    #16
    Re: Spirit guides

    I have spoken with both my spirit guides and those of others. I believe they can be very helpful when it comes to dealing with dark spirits. e.g. ones that may hold a grudge from a past life, ones that avenge your family, etc.

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      #17
      Re: Spirit guides

      I have often wondered if we might have animal spirit guides at times?

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        #18
        Re: Spirit guides

        Originally posted by Thirsty Fox View Post
        I have often wondered if we might have animal spirit guides at times?
        Within Shamanic practices it's very common to have animal guides / spirits.
        I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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          #19
          Re: Spirit guides

          Of course! I knew that. What about as Gods, Goddesses or Deities?

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            #20
            Re: Spirit guides

            Originally posted by Thirsty Fox View Post
            Of course! I knew that. What about as Gods, Goddesses or Deities?
            I'd have to say yes. Figure Coyote in Native American lore is a coyote, the Thunder Bird is a giant bird form that is often seen in the sky, especially during lightning storms. Then consider how many gods / goddesses are animorphic in appearance such as Bastet appearing as a cat, Mafdet appearing as a leopard or panther, Pahket as another wild cat form or even a lioness.

            You can also consider the avatar's of a given divinity figure. Artemis with her deer, bear associations. Hekate with her black dogs associations which suggest her presence. I believe it is Athena who has the Owl who is her avatar that at times is supposed to not only have appeared but at times as a physical manifestation that guided hero's and such. One can't rule out figure heads, statuary, etc either. Consider in the stories of the Argonautica Jason is supposed to have a figure head that Hera was supposed to have spoken to him through and guided him on the journey to get the Golden Fleece. So Hera would animate the figurehead to speak to him.
            I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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              #21
              Re: Spirit guides

              Thank you for that info. I feel drawn in that direction. I will see where it takes me.

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                #22
                Re: Spirit guides

                Originally posted by Thirsty Fox View Post
                I used to contact her thru a pendulum. It's been awhile. I should try again
                That's how I confer with mine daily, although I've gotten to the point I can usually intuit what they have to say.

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                  #23
                  Re: Spirit guides

                  Sumerians made their statues hollow so the deity could inhabit the statue. They used the figure as a home for the deity and not just a representation. The god or goddess was given food, drink, and entertainment. It was cleaned by the temple maidens each day. While this practice is not carried out in Arratu we offer deity the option of staying with us after a ceremony is concluded with this line:
                  "Stay if you will, go if you must, but remain ever near in love and trust."
                  The Dragon sees infinity and those it touches are forced to feel the reality of it.
                  I am his student and his partner. He is my guide and an ominous friend.

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                    #24
                    Re: Spirit guides

                    Originally posted by DragonsFriend View Post
                    Sumerians made their statues hollow so the deity could inhabit the statue. They used the figure as a home for the deity and not just a representation. The god or goddess was given food, drink, and entertainment. It was cleaned by the temple maidens each day. While this practice is not carried out in Arratu we offer deity the option of staying with us after a ceremony is concluded with this line:
                    "Stay if you will, go if you must, but remain ever near in love and trust."
                    While some of the statuary pieces may have been hollow the Greeks didn't make them like that except for the very large ones. Yet the custom of feeding, honoring, clothing, etc was carried out at all the temple complexes as well as some sanctuaries. A practice that crossed over into certain forms of Christianity, especially Catholicism. Can't tell how many times I drove through melted wax in Spain when the effigies where taken out and walked to the ocean or other places. Semana Santa near as I recall is really big for parading the statues, effigies, etc through the streets and such with blessings, honorings, etc.
                    I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                      #25
                      Re: Spirit guides

                      Originally posted by R. Eugene Laughlin View Post
                      I don't practice much ceremony these days, but I have a lot of GD and GD-inspired work in my background, and a penitent for Western Esoteric literature and history.

                      The reason I brought it up here isn't to discuss ceremonial magick for its own sake, but because I think the Abramelin Operation may offer an adaptable template for seeking and establishing a relationship with a personal tutelary spirit. Conversation about spirit guides seems common enough on occult-oriented discussion these days. Many anecdotes suggest that these spirit relationships tend to form serendipitously. Some might find a relatively systematic approach useful, and I have some (not so ceremonial) ideas about that if there's interest.
                      Given the above claim about your background, I find it particularly interesting that you should recommend the Abramelin Operation as an "adaptable template" for anything. If you are recommending the ritual, surely you have read the Book of Abramelin the Mage? The sheer length of the ritual notwithstanding (for those who don't know, it's supposed to be performed over a 12-18 month period), I fail to see how it's a ritual that one should be merrily adapting for personal usage. The instructions are quite specific, and the section dealing with the Goetic Demons alone is particularly dangerous if one doesn't know what one is doing. Even the Demonolatry version (which involves working with the Demons rather than binding and forcing them, as the original version does) requires a great deal of training, preparation, skill and self control. Of course, if the Mathers translation is the only one you've read, then that explains your opinion on the matter (though I'm not sure why you claim that you've read the passage you quoted 'in context' when Mathers' writings are some of the foundational sources for the HGA as the Higher Self).

                      Also, I assume you meant that you have a 'penchant' for Western Esoteric literature, rather a 'penitant'? Auto-correct can be a pain sometimes.

                      Originally posted by Thirsty Fox View Post
                      I have often wondered if we might have animal spirit guides at times?
                      Absolutely.

                      My experience is that the overarching 'grandparent spirit' of an animal species acts as a spirit guide for a number of people. There are also individual animal spirits who can act as guides too, and a lot of internal guides (aspects of the self you meet during Innerworlds journeys) who manifest as animals. I have more animal spirit guides than I do humanoid ones, and they run the range from Horse as a lifelong primary guide (the grandparent spirit of the species - what many used to refer to as a 'totem' spirit), to several individual animal spirits, to internal manifestations that have taken on animal form (Crow, Black Bear, Salmon, Green Tree Viper/Bamboo Viper, Horse, Dragon, a prehistoric canid in the Borophaginae family, African Lion and European Hare). I have a number of individual animal spirits in my team of aides... my drum spirit is an Eastern Brown Snake, I have two Kangaroo spirits (a young Red and an Eastern Grey) one of whom watches over my physical body while I journey and the other who watches over my astral body, and a Red Fox spirit who has joined me but who hasn't put his hand up for any particular job yet (I haven't been put in a situation where I need him yet).

                      So yes, animals can be spirit guides! As MonSno said... it's particularly common in shamanic traditions.

                      Originally posted by DragonsFriend View Post
                      Sumerians made their statues hollow so the deity could inhabit the statue. They used the figure as a home for the deity and not just a representation. The god or goddess was given food, drink, and entertainment. It was cleaned by the temple maidens each day. While this practice is not carried out in Arratu we offer deity the option of staying with us after a ceremony is concluded with this line:
                      "Stay if you will, go if you must, but remain ever near in love and trust."
                      Your closing statement sounds very Wiccan to me. How much of Arratu have you drawn from non Sumerian sources? I only ask because I have an interest in Sumerian inspired paths (stimulated by my work with Ereshkigal and Nergal) and yours is the first one I've come across that seems to draw heavily on non-Sumerian or even Hermetic sources, yet claims to be based on a very specific historical timeframe.
                      Last edited by Rae'ya; 13 Dec 2015, 21:33.

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                        #26
                        Re: Spirit guides

                        Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                        Given the above claim about your background, I find it particularly interesting that you should recommend the Abramelin Operation as an "adaptable template" for anything. If you are recommending the ritual, surely you have read the Book of Abramelin the Mage? The sheer length of the ritual notwithstanding (for those who don't know, it's supposed to be performed over a 12-18 month period), I fail to see how it's a ritual that one should be merrily adapting for personal usage.
                        I'd be happy to have a conversation about it, starting with your insightful comments. Judging from the other posts to this thread, it's probably not a good fit right here. I'll start another thread for it if you're game.

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                          #27
                          Re: Spirit guides

                          Originally posted by R. Eugene Laughlin View Post
                          I'd be happy to have a conversation about it, starting with your insightful comments. Judging from the other posts to this thread, it's probably not a good fit right here. I'll start another thread for it if you're game.
                          I'm always game.

                          You can stick it in Left Hand Paths if you like. It's the closest section we have for ceremonial work and it will catch the attention of the few ceremonialists we have here at PF.

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                            #28
                            Re: Spirit guides

                            Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                            Your closing statement sounds very Wiccan to me. How much of Arratu have you drawn from non Sumerian sources? I only ask because I have an interest in Sumerian inspired paths (stimulated by my work with Ereshkigal and Nergal) and yours is the first one I've come across that seems to draw heavily on non-Sumerian or even Hermetic sources, yet claims to be based on a very specific historical timeframe.
                            I don't know what about the closing statement sounds Wiccan because neither of the traditions I have initiated into were Wiccan. Arratu is not a reconstruction of the Sumerian practices but rather based on the concepts recorded early in their written history(before the change to a patriarchal society) and brought forward to be meaningful in the world of today.
                            My limited experience with Wiccan rituals (public affairs I attended locally) the spirits are dismissed and the energy of the circle is banished. In Arratu we do neither.
                            The Dragon sees infinity and those it touches are forced to feel the reality of it.
                            I am his student and his partner. He is my guide and an ominous friend.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: Spirit guides

                              Originally posted by DragonsFriend View Post
                              I don't know what about the closing statement sounds Wiccan because neither of the traditions I have initiated into were Wiccan... My limited experience with Wiccan rituals (public affairs I attended locally) the spirits are dismissed and the energy of the circle is banished. In Arratu we do neither.
                              It sounds Wiccan because it's almost word for word, identical to the phrase listed in neo-Wiccan books for closing down the Quarters. Usually the last bit is "in perfect love and perfect trust", but the first bit is identical. The phrase I've read in almost every single neo-Wiccan book I've ever read is "Stay if you will, go if you must, in perfect love and perfect trust." Phrases regarding 'love and trust' are also incredibly common in neo-Wiccan paths, yet I've never seen them in relation to Sumerian or Mesopotamian paths.

                              I just find it interesting that a number of your Arratu rituals and phrases are almost identical to sources that you claim never to have been exposed to. It's a very strange sort of coincidence.

                              Originally posted by DragonsFriend View Post
                              Arratu is not a reconstruction of the Sumerian practices but rather based on the concepts recorded early in their written history(before the change to a patriarchal society) and brought forward to be meaningful in the world of today.
                              I'd be interested in some of your source texts, if you don't mind. I've been looking for a book of Mesopotamian folklore and religion that is not centered on Innana and the ridiculous modern interpretation of her Descent myth. If you have recommendations, they'd be welcome.

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                                #30
                                The Dragon sees infinity and those it touches are forced to feel the reality of it.
                                I am his student and his partner. He is my guide and an ominous friend.

                                Comment

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