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Thread: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

  1. #21
    The Gaze of the Abyss B. de Corbin's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    LOL -

    But actually, if you go back to the original article in the first post, the idea expressed was that, if science can eventually (I know - not likely, but hypothetically) explain all the forces at work in the universe, and how they interact, there would be no place left for "a deity."

    In other words - if there is nothing unknown needing to be explained, is there still a place for "god"?

    While it's a hugely hypothetical question, the implication of a "no" answer is "god is a thing used to explain what we don't already know."
    Those who have suffered understand suffering and therefore extend their hand.

    I can't do everything, but I can do something.

  2. #22

    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by B. de Corbin View Post
    Theoretical physicist Sean Carroll explains why he believes that science will one day be able to prove God does not exist. [Link censored by Sollomyn to comply with Forum Rules.]
    Wow; very thought-provoking! Thank you very much for sharing this.

    My first thought on it, before reading the article, was that science cannot empirically prove or disprove the existence of God, because there's too many variables as to what exactly that might be; as has been said, it's all dependent on the definitions of God, or gods.

    Interestingly enough though, the scientific explanation of everything lines up perfectly with my religion. Magick is just science that isn't fully understood yet; at least some forms of magick; there's a lot of magick that is perfectly explainable by various sciences as we know them, (haha; science is kind of polytheistic as well!). I have pretty simple beliefs, and I'm pretty sure that there is an afterlife, because I've seen a ghost before; Grandma Wanda as her friends and family called her; the grandmother of the kid who used to bully me in elementary school haha.

    I was locked up a couple thousand miles away or so, for a few years or so, at the age of twelve; after returning home, I'd often go for joyrides on my dad's ATV; we lived down a long dirt road, just off another long dirt road in the interior of Alaska. While riding home from the small village about ten miles yonder one afternoon, I was passing the lonely trailer-house of Grandma Wanda. She was standing on the front lawn, staring at her house as I skidded around the corner and roared past her, shouting "HI GRANDMA WANDA!!!" and waving hello at her like a giddy little maniac, (I'm only 5'9" and 146 pounds; probably a little smaller back then.)

    Now...I don't know why exactly, though I have my suspicions, but I've always had extraordinary sensory perception; all my five senses are dialed up to a hundred it seems, and it is quite the double-edged sword in my humble opinion. As a result of my particular wiring, I was able to see Grandma Wanda perfectly; clear as day, standing there in her iconic white dress with little blue flowers, and long, flowing white hair, and undoubtedly REAL, despite my traveling past her around a slight bend at fifty to sixty miles per hour, (digital spedometer, hehehe). She turned around to look at me with a strange look on her face...in retrospect; I didn't think much of it in the moment; I just kept focusing on the road for the most part...loved going fast, haha. Her expression was an odd mixture of confusion and sorrow. Whatever, right? Upon arriving back at the family farm though, I exclaimed to my mother in the kitchen that it was nice seeing Grandma Wanda again, as I took off my gear.

    "Honey...Grandma Wanda died a couple of years ago." she said in a concerned tone.

    I insisted that she had to be mistaken; "I know what I saw!" I told her. I went back to the trailer house to investigate. Upon further study, the place seemed to have been abandoned; overgrown...the trailer house rotting into the soil upon which it was perched, overlooking a small cliff across the Delta river; just off the Tanana; a tributary of the more well-known Yukon river. I ran around the perimeter, searching for any signs of life; her grandson even, perhaps...but there was nothing; nothing but a dead dog tied to a tree by a piece of hemp rope; a yellow labrador; half-eaten by maggots. I kinda had an emotional breakdown. It took me a long time to wrap my head around it, but I knew it was her, even though she'd been dead for years while I was in juvenile hall. ...I know I'm not crazy; the only next logical explanation that I can arrive at, until I discover the exact sciences behind it, as unreasonable as it may sound, has to be, "Ghosts are real...and I can see them...and they look just as real as you or me."

    ...Hahaha; maybe that's why I think the Earth is overpopulated!!!

    In all seriousness, no; I take overpopulation kinda seriously, and suspect that MOST of the people I see ARE actually alive...but ever since Grandma Wanda...I can never be absolutey SURE of that...and it honestly kinda scares me a little haha, but it's all good; I've gotten used to weird stuff happening around me; I basically have six or seven somewhat unbelievable events throughout the last couple of decades or so, that have pretty much CONVINCED me that the supernatural is indeed real.......I just think it's perfectly Natural.



    --Sollomyn
    Last edited by Sollomyn; 10 Mar 2019 at 00:06.

  3. #23
    Sleepy Optimistic discord's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    Pity I missed this topic.
    It all hinges on how one defines a god( as others said previously). Many faiths at their core are a conflict between primal forces.any of which can and have been identified.
    What's missing is that VPG/UPG part.
    And if a faith did not rely on that much, then what's to disprove?
    I've met several dedicated sun worshipers, who worship the physical sun. It is their god, their creator.
    They view the different sun-deities of other faiths as personal manifestations of the individuals psyche.

  4. #24
    Bronze Member Bartmanhomer's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    This is a long debate that been discussed for thousands of years. I'll said this: We don't know for certain.

  5. #25
    PF Ordo Hereticus MaskedOne's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by B. de Corbin View Post
    LOL -

    But actually, if you go back to the original article in the first post, the idea expressed was that, if science can eventually (I know - not likely, but hypothetically) explain all the forces at work in the universe, and how they interact, there would be no place left for "a deity."

    In other words - if there is nothing unknown needing to be explained, is there still a place for "god"?

    While it's a hugely hypothetical question, the implication of a "no" answer is "god is a thing used to explain what we don't already know."

    Depending on definition, at the point where human science can accurately explain all forces and events in the universe, there will be a god. It will be a mildly schizophrenic god manifesting through billions of avatars and its name will be humanity. Now whether or not humanity will be the lone god of creation or the highest god may br open to question but a complete and accurate understanding of everything is no small feat.
    "It is not simply enough to know the light…a Jedi must feel the tension between the two sides of the Force…in himself and in the universe."
    ―Thon

    "When to the Force you truly give yourself, all you do expresses the truth of who you are,"

    Yoda

    Yoda told stories, and ate, and cried, and laughed: and the Padawans saw that life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

    Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

    "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

    John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

    "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

    Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis



  6. #26
    The Gaze of the Abyss B. de Corbin's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaskedOne View Post
    ...but a complete and accurate understanding of everything is no small feat.
    Yeah, but we've got hours and hours to work on it...
    Those who have suffered understand suffering and therefore extend their hand.

    I can't do everything, but I can do something.

  7. #27
    Member Pythagoras's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    There is no such thing as a perfect measurement or analyzing sequence within science meaning that there will always be things just outside the realm of science and the human mind that are unexplainable.

  8. #28
    Magnificent Bastard ThorsSon's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    Sorry to resurrect an old thread, and furthermore to only repeat what a lot of people have already said... but as an actual atheist, I thought I might put in my 2 cents on this thread in the Atheism & Agnosticism board:

    As several people have pointed out, science does not, and cannot prove negatives.
    Scientific theories must be presented in a way that they can potentially be falsified in order to be considered scientifically valid.
    If I put forth the idea that DNA is always ordered according to the Latin Alphabet, that theory is easily testable, and easily falsifiable... all it would take is a single observation of a genome that doesn't follow this rule to falsify my claim.
    If, as Bertrand Russell did, I put forth the idea that there is a teapot, too small to be seen by any telescope, orbiting between Earth and Mars... there is no way to falsify that claim. It would be simple enough to prove, all one would have to do is find the teapot... but it would be impossible to disprove, since there is no way to ever prove that the teapot doesn't exist somewhere in the millions of miles of orbital path that is not currently being observed at any one time.

    God is kinda like Russell's Teapot, except MUCH less falsifiable, since (as has already been pointed out by several people in this thread), there is no one definition of "god" that can be agreed upon. There is no way to nail down every place that some concept of a god might inhabit. There is no possible way to disprove every concept of god, gods, goddess, or goddesses... without even bringing into the conversation pantheistic or panentheistic conceptions of divinity.

    On the other hand, evidence continues to reduce the space that the divine might inhabit... but it is impossible to ever reduce that space to 0.

    Science does not, and can not know everything. The mere existence of the number pi is proof of this. No matter how precisely we ever calculate the number pi, there will always be an infinite amount of information that we do not know about it. There will always be an infinite number of integers beyond the largest one we have ever counted to. There will always be an infinite number of prime numbers beyond the largest one we have ever found. There will always be an infinite number of numbers between 0 and 1 that we have not yet observed... and those examples all reside in the domain of mathematics, which, as has been pointed out, DOES deal in proofs.

    Science is far less absolute than math, and even math can't ever know everything.
    "Don't ever miss a good opportunity to shut up." - Harvey Davis "Gramps"

  9. #29
    Bronze Member Bartmanhomer's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    I'm a Christian but I'm also not anti-science. This is my two points so hear me out on this one. People have been debating the existence of God since the beginning of time and it's always end in an endless stalemate. No matter who's right or wrong it's always a draw.

  10. #30
    Nihilistic Goddess Medusa's Avatar
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    Re: Can science prove God doesn't exist?

    When people ask me this (and I know they want to debate it with their right answer and my wrong view) I give two replies.
    Usually I say God doesn't exist for me.

    But when I'm feeling extra naughty:
    Satan is my spirit animal

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