Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 42

Thread: To smack or not to smack?

  1. #21

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    First, the fact you never even bothered asking me how hard I spank, speaks volumes about the intent in your line of questioning.

    No, Faye 15-20 smacks doesn't bruise, PROVIDED you aren't beating on them with all your strength; something I would never do, and I am insulted that you would even imply that I would!

    I need a break from this debate; it's getting too ridiculous.
    Last edited by Sollomyn; 25 Mar 2019 at 17:23.

  2. #22
    Sr. Member faye_cat's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    492
    Religion
    Ecletic pagan.
    Location
    Tennessee, USA
    Phrase
    This too shall pass.

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    You are the one who used "wail" in your first post and "smack" in the rest of them. The title of this thread is "to smack or not to smack". Words matter. I asked you where the line is. To me, using those words along with descriptions of leaping at a child, growling, pinning them down, that does not imply self control----not for you personally, but in general. So when you used those words---based on those definitions---it wasn't my intention to insult, but to inquire.. Which again, is why I asked you where the line was, many times. I know some kids who bruise very easily, and some who don't bruise often no matter what. Again, in my experience, "wailing" or "smacking" them involves great force---which is why I asked.

    Additionally, you were the babysitter--the mother did not want physical discipline on her child, and you spanked--however hard--her child. So again, who gets to decide what abuse is vs what discipline is, and who has the right to discipline physically the child?
    “I am Cat and I walk alone and all ways are the same to me.” ~Rudyard Kipling, The Cat Who Walks By Himself

  3. #23

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    You are the one who used "wail" in your first post and "smack" in the rest of them.
    Wail implies force yes; what your wailing on though should provide the context of that force. A child's bottom is obviously not something you'd "wail" on with all your strength. Wail is just a word that my parents always used, so it was natural for me to define it that way as well; it's just a slightly more severe synonym for "smack" in my mind. Yes, I used the word wail because that specific spanking was more severe than most spankings I've given, because I NEEDED her to know how dangerous what she just did was. (My sister was perfectly fine with it also, no surprise there at all seeing as she's an advocate of spanking as well.)


    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    The title of this thread is "to smack or not to smack". Words matter.
    Yes; words matter. I understand that a lot better now.

    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    I asked you where the line is. To me, using those words along with descriptions of leaping at a child, growling, pinning them down, that does not imply self control----not for you personally, but in general.
    Okay, first, I never leapt at the child. I said that I leapt out of my SEAT , which was to say that I stood up out of my seat, really fast, in an authorative manner.

    I didn't leap at her from across the room like an animalistic crazy person.

    Secondly, I never growled at the five year old; I did growl in the presence of my niece though; that was because I'd just been ripped to shreds on the frantic run through the jungle. YOU'D be growling too hahaha.

    Thirdly, I HAD to pin that five year olds legs between my own legs because she could have KILLED me with all the flailing and kicking she was doing; one wrong kick to my temple and I would've been DONE for. I took that situation VERY seriously. The way you describe it almost makes it sound like I picked her up Ultimate Wrestlng style and body-slammed her into the floor, "pinning her down".


    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    So when you used those words---based on those definitions---it wasn't my intention to insult, but to inquire.. Which again, is why I asked you where the line was, many times. I know some kids who bruise very easily, and some who don't bruise often no matter what. Again, in my experience, "wailing" or "smacking" them involves great force---which is why I asked.
    I've never used great force on a child; I've only ever used about 25% strength because I've only had to spank 3-6 year olds, and any more than 25% would be classified as abuse according to MY line; I don't care about other people's lines. THEY have no right or place to tell my family and I how to discipline children in our custody. In terms of where my personal line is in regards to spanking, I start off weakly and gradually increase the intensity until they're crying, and then I stop one they've been crying for about five seconds, then I go through an after-care routine with them that involves hugs, snacks, and a gentle lecture about why they got a spanking.

    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    Additionally, you were the babysitter--the mother did not want physical discipline on her child, and you spanked--however hard--her child. So again, who gets to decide what abuse is vs what discipline is, and who has the right to discipline physically the child?
    In my own defense, the mother never said a thing about discipline of any kind to me; I simply assumed that if her child started acting out, that she would want me to discipline them, because....well...that's just what I've always thought normal parents would want for their child! Call me crazy!

    Additionally, not only was it the out-of-control-five-year-old who told me her mom didn't want her to be disciplined (can you REALLY blame me for not believing her??? ), but her mother, although upset initially, ended up being GRATEFUL to me for doing what she never had the stomach to, because believe it or not, her daughter's behavior drastically improved from just that ONE spanking, (and it wasn't even all that hard), I'd say I did a FANTASTIC job as a babysitter hahaha. She absolutely adores me too haha; we'd never have the wonderful relationship we have if I'd have just let her do whatever she wanted to. I couldn't even imagine trying to get her to stay in a time out; she was completely belligerent, disrespectful and disobedient. I don't really care who their parents are; I will NOT tolerate that behavior in my house. If their parents end up disapproving of my methods, they should find somebody else for the job. Interestingly enough though, my cousin kept having me babysit her daughter even after that first encounter. That was the only time I felt a need to give her a spanking though; she was always on her best behavior and we got along great.


    ....Lastly.....I think I owe you an apology. I got pretty upset when I felt like you were calling me a child abuser. The reason is because I was sexually abused numerous times as a child, so I tend to take such an accusation very personally. I've never abused a child in my life, and I never will.


    --Sollomyn
    Last edited by Sollomyn; 25 Mar 2019 at 18:27.

  4. #24
    Sr. Member faye_cat's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    492
    Religion
    Ecletic pagan.
    Location
    Tennessee, USA
    Phrase
    This too shall pass.

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    I didn't want to believe you were a child abuser, and while I was questioning the story you were telling, I did not want to infer you were one. I understand you more clearly now. I personally still think that physical discipline is definitely a last resort, and not something to be used for disrespect or anything non life threatening or in an instance where they could have hurt someone else. I understand your line a bit more now, even if I still am not sure I agree with where it is. =P But that's opinions. I was trying to see where you thought the line was---maybe not for yourself, but for everyone else, because you thought it should be allowed. But it's a blurry line, and not everyone can see when they cross over it (Again, not saying you did, just in general)

    I personally also don't believe that anyone should hit a child without express consent of their parent---note what I said about--and that without that consent it's assumed as a "no go". (Barring that the child is physically hurting someone else. If I'm being smacked by a child and I cannot remove one of us from the equation I will restrain them until they stop, but I will not hit)

    I have been abused by people I trust, and it's not always the hardest hits that hurt the most---it's a level of trust that gets destroyed if you hit in anger, if you hit when emotional, when you hit without explaining yourself, when you physically hold them down or you run up on them--all of that could be construed as abuse--not physical, but emotional. So that's why I ask where the line is. And if someone can't answer where that line is---on every form of abuse vs discipline--then they need to think long and hard about utilizing physical discipline. Does that make sense?
    “I am Cat and I walk alone and all ways are the same to me.” ~Rudyard Kipling, The Cat Who Walks By Himself

  5. #25
    Apprentice of Doom Shahaku's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    2,257
    Gender
    Female
    Religion
    Eclectic Witch
    Location
    Iowa
    Phrase
    Move forward with purpose. -Sherillyn Kenyon

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    We have spanked my daughter in the past. It only made her behavior worse. The only time I felt truly justified was when I smacked her hand for trying to put the nail clippers in the electrical outlet. Now I'm part of several gentle parenting / attachment parenting groups. I feel like they take it too far. I've seen patents in that group say that it's abusive to put a kid in time out. Parenting is never easy and you can't know what is like until you're immersed in it 24/7/365. There's no perfect answer that is going to work for every kid. All spanking taught me growing up was to lie better and hide things.

    I really like the article I've been seeing recently about Inuit parenting and using storytelling to teach. They consider it imperative to never lose their temper.

    - - - Updated - - -

    We have spanked my daughter in the past. It only made her behavior worse. The only time I felt truly justified was when I smacked her hand for trying to put the nail clippers in the electrical outlet. Now I'm part of several gentle parenting / attachment parenting groups. I feel like they take it too far. I've seen patents in that group say that it's abusive to put a kid in time out. Parenting is never easy and you can't know what is like until you're immersed in it 24/7/365. There's no perfect answer that is going to work for every kid. All spanking taught me growing up was to lie better and hide things.

    I really like the article I've been seeing recently about Inuit parenting and using storytelling to teach. They consider it imperative to never lose their temper.
    We are what we are. Nothing more, nothing less. There is good and evil among every kind of people. It's the evil among us who rule now. -Anne Bishop, Daughter of the Blood

    I wondered if he could ever understand that it was a blessing, not a sin, to be graced with more than one love.
    It could be complicated; of course it could be complicated. And it opened one up to the possibility of more pain and loss.
    Still, it was a blessing I would never relinquish. Love, genuine love, was always a cause for joy.
    -Jacqueline Carey, Naamah's Curse

    Service to your fellows is the root of peace.

  6. #26
    Sr. Member faye_cat's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    492
    Religion
    Ecletic pagan.
    Location
    Tennessee, USA
    Phrase
    This too shall pass.

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    The only time I felt truly justified was when I smacked her hand for trying to put the nail clippers in the electrical outlet.
    That's about where I am---I will smack their hands away from something that would injure them (for younger kids I may give a pat pat on the butt to ease them away from a bad path or behavior) or sometimes I will cuff their shoulder (never hard) to remind them of their manners or stop a behavior. But these are things I do to adults as well, and it's never hard. I haven't heard of the Inuit method, I'll have to look into that.
    A lot of kids understand words long before they can speak, so words should always accompany every discipline method you utilize.

    Shahaku, a lot of parenting groups waffle between too hard and too permissive and it's definitely a challenge to find a community that works.
    “I am Cat and I walk alone and all ways are the same to me.” ~Rudyard Kipling, The Cat Who Walks By Himself

  7. #27

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post
    I didn't want to believe you were a child abuser, and while I was questioning the story you were telling, I did not want to infer you were one. I understand you more clearly now. I personally still think that physical discipline is definitely a last resort, and not something to be used for disrespect or anything non life threatening or in an instance where they could have hurt someone else. I understand your line a bit more now, even if I still am not sure I agree with where it is. =P But that's opinions. I was trying to see where you thought the line was---maybe not for yourself, but for everyone else, because you thought it should be allowed. But it's a blurry line, and not everyone can see when they cross over it (Again, not saying you did, just in general)
    Quote Originally Posted by faye_cat View Post

    I personally also don't believe that anyone should hit a child without express consent of their parent---note what I said about--and that without that consent it's assumed as a "no go". (Barring that the child is physically hurting someone else. If I'm being smacked by a child and I cannot remove one of us from the equation I will restrain them until they stop, but I will not hit)

    I have been abused by people I trust, and it's not always the hardest hits that hurt the most---it's a level of trust that gets destroyed if you hit in anger, if you hit when emotional, when you hit without explaining yourself, when you physically hold them down or you run up on them--all of that could be construed as abuse--not physical, but emotional. So that's why I ask where the line is. And if someone can't answer where that line is---on every form of abuse vs discipline--then they need to think long and hard about utilizing physical discipline. Does that make sense?
    That makes sense; for me personally I'd never slap a child in the face, or spank them out of anger. It takes a fair amount of work to spank a child properly, too haha; I wouldn't have the energy for it if I were merely angry at them; I'd have to be spanking them for a good reason. Extreme disrespect is a good reason in my own mind, because such behavior actually is very dangerous for them; if they grow up thinking the can cuss out anyone they want, and be an overall jerk to people around them, then one day, they're going to end up saying the entirely wrong thing, to the entirely wrong person, and that person is probably going to KILL them.

    Hence, it's extremely important to me to make sure kids grow up with good manners and respect for their human brothers and sisters, (you'll notice out of my 178 posts on here that I have never sworn or cursed at anyone, or even just in general haha; manners are super important to me haha; doesn't matter how upset I might be.)

    It should also be noted that I take no pleasure in spanking a child; it wracks me with guilt pretty bad every time, and I usually need a stiff drink once all the little ones are asleep. I just remind myself that it's for their own good, and that if I don't hold the line, they're not going to be prepared for the big, dangerous world out there. That thought disturbs me a lot more than having to give spankings.
    Last edited by Sollomyn; 25 Mar 2019 at 18:53.

  8. #28
    The Gaze of the Abyss B. de Corbin's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    8,308
    Religion
    Alchemist and Neo-American Redneck Buddhist
    Location
    Frozen Northern Michigan, near Thunder Bay
    Phrase
    Where are the tweezers?

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollomyn View Post
    I didn't actually read them all; I just did a google search and skimmed through the pages enough to determine that there were plenty of studies in BOTH arenas.
    As a general rule, it is advisable to read before using search engine results to "determine" anything. The word "studies," used on the internet, is generally meaningless, unless one is willing to check the source. Thinking well requires effort.

    I have my own line; no bruising, no blood, no contusions, and no permanent injury.

    So far I've never crossed it.
    Define "no permanent injury." Does teaching a child that those who are bigger, stronger, and more brutal get to call the shots qualify as permanent injury?
    Last edited by B. de Corbin; 26 Mar 2019 at 01:43.
    Those who have suffered understand suffering and therefore extend their hand.

    I can't do everything, but I can do something.

  9. #29
    Silver Member Bartmanhomer's Avatar
    Reputation
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    2,025
    Religion
    Christian
    Location
    New York, NY USA

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    I'm just going to say this once without going through with this ridiculous heated debate, hitting a child is wrong, especially all type of abuses that involves a child is wrong. I don't give a crap what everybody thinks it's ok to use physical force against a child. To me it not ok at all. I don't have kids and if I have kids I will never hit my child period.

  10. #30

    Re: To smack or not to smack?

    Quote Originally Posted by B. de Corbin View Post
    As a general rule, it is advisable to read before using search engine results to "determine" anything. The word "studies," used on the internet, is generally meaningless, unless one is willing to check the source. Thinking well requires effort.
    I really don't care about studies; I don't need studies to confirm for me what I've seen with my own two eyes to be true on numerous occasions.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. de Corbin View Post
    Define "no permanent injury." Does teaching a child that those who are bigger, stronger, and more brutal get to call the shots qualify as permanent injury?
    No permanent injury should be pretty self-explanatory; I'm not sure what your point was with this question. I don't teach children that those who are bigger, stronger, and more brutal get to call the shots. I teach them that adults get to call the shots, and that deliberate disobedience and disrespect will warrant consequences while they're in my home, under my roof, eating the food that I put on the table for them. Those are my rules for my house, and I don't care if anyone else have those rules for themselves, because that is absolutely none of my business.

    I'm not "brutal" by any means, I'm strict. There's a difference.
    Last edited by Sollomyn; 26 Mar 2019 at 05:15.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •