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People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

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    #16
    Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

    Look, in my opinion, Disney should keep the character white. This is not because of a racial issue. It is because of the story and what Disney traditionally introduced to us as children. BMH, you were all up in arms when we were talking about Will Smith as the genie. So why is it so big that Disney make it's choices on their movies? When they make the live-action Little Mermaid, it needs to be true to the original, however, it does need to show diversification as well. I won't expect it to purely show white mermaids and mermen in the movie. However, from what I know of myth I do know that there have been asian mermaids. We just need to be calm and not judge one another and think of this in a calm manner. No judgment. It isn't our decision and if we are happy or unhappy, let it be.
    Anubisa

    Dedicated and devoted to Lord Anubis and Lady Bast. A follower of the path of Egyptian Wicca.

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      #17
      Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

      A- She is a mermaid. Fictional. Plenty of room for interpretation. B- Ariel's ethnicity as anything but merfolk is not in any way relevant to the plot. C- They strayed one iota from the original Disney version. It doesn't cancel out the original version. D-The movie isn't even particularly true to the original story, is that offensive? I have Danish heritage, should I be offended that Disney doesn't make them obviously Danish mermaids? The original story was written by a Dane. E- Disney's main objective is to encourage as many people to see as many movies as they can churn out, and then spend lots of money on merchandise and amusement park visits. One of they ways they do this is by getting little girls to identify with the characters. It has clearly occurred to them that this works more broadly if they have diverse looking characters. F- Or maybe, just maybe, this woman had the most charisma and acting/singing talent in a vast pool of candidates.

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        #18
        Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

        Originally posted by anubisa View Post
        Look, in my opinion, Disney should keep the character white. This is not because of a racial issue. It is because of the story and what Disney traditionally introduced to us as children. BMH, you were all up in arms when we were talking about Will Smith as the genie. So why is it so big that Disney make it's choices on their movies? When they make the live-action Little Mermaid, it needs to be true to the original, however, it does need to show diversification as well. I won't expect it to purely show white mermaids and mermen in the movie. However, from what I know of myth I do know that there have been asian mermaids. We just need to be calm and not judge one another and think of this in a calm manner. No judgment. It isn't our decision and if we are happy or unhappy, let it be.
        That's different. Will Smith being genie isn't even relevant in this thread. Like I said a black mermaid is a great Idea.

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          #19
          Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

          Disney has made the right move publising this before the movie came out. We can all talk about it and get it out of our systems before the actual release date. So hopefully opening night won't be over-shadowed by shock that a character people are so familiar with has completely changed in appearance. That's all this is... shock at being jolted out of the familiar.

          When I think about the character, Ariel, I think of a girl peeling away her outter props (ie royal status and powerful father figure!) to chase after what she wants. The next time I watch the Little Mermaid it will be as a parent and I'm sure I'm going to be absolutely in a mess of tears with that whole parent letting go of the child thing happening! I love the way curiousity and its pitfalls is portrayed in the film not just through Ariel (think famous fork-comb!), but through Eric as well who is curious about Ariel but in a way that lets her be just as she is. The thing with curiousity is that in our discoveries, we can make assumptions as to how things must be and so often mistake what truly is. Eric was so focused on the sound of Ariel's voice, he mistook her voice for herself. A necessary mistake to make concerning growing-up.

          Don't really need to be of a particular colour to portray all of that.

          However, Monsno I appreciate your point about culture and its identifiable race being tied to a particular kind of narrative. Personally, I can't identify a narrative that would have to be quintessentially white. Maybe it's something you need outside eyes for?

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            #20
            Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

            Originally posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
            That's different. Will Smith being genie isn't even relevant in this thread. Like I said a black mermaid is a great Idea.
            HOW is this different? Genie and Ariel are both fictional characters. Neither they, nor their represented races exist in the real world. They can be portrayed by absolutely anybody.
            �Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted. And experience is often the most valuable thing you have to offer.�
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              #21
              Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

              Originally posted by Juniper View Post
              HOW is this different? Genie and Ariel are both fictional characters. Neither they, nor their represented races exist in the real world. They can be portrayed by absolutely anybody.
              I'm saying that Will Smith playing Genie is not even relevant because of his medicore acting and of course he can Genie can play whoever he want to play.
              Last edited by Bartmanhomer; 07 Jul 2019, 09:02.

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                #22
                Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                I appear to have worked myself right up about this, mostly because I was completely flabbergasted that it was even an issue. It seems like such a little stretch of the brain as to be non-existent. But here we are.

                I also find myself siding with BH about Will Smith. TBH I don't see race as an issue with a fictional genie either, and given geography and history, the only real cultural problem I could scrape up with Will Smith would be his American-ness representing another culture. Which of course applies pretty broadly in any of these movies. Will Smith just happened to be filling some pretty big shoes, and I wasn't sure he was up to it, even though I generally enjoy his performances. I could see why he was in the running, I just didn't have the sense that it was spot-on casting. If he had been the first genie, no problem. Also, I can't really come up with anyone better. I see why he was on the short list.

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                  #23
                  Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                  Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                  NO people are against Ariel the Little Mermaid being black since she is based upon Nordic lore and a white character with red hair. People get pissed when other character's are white washed and have their ethnicity changed that is the point but going the other way to make character's diverse suddenly is ok.
                  Actually, from what I've read, the original little mermaid was green. As in, in the story written by the original author. Since I haven't read the original story myself, I'm not sure if that comes from the story or original artwork. I know the mermaid on the cover of many original copies is green. One thing Disney has attempted with these live action remakes is to incorporate more of the adult themes that they dumbed down or whitewashed from the originals. Giving the little mermaid a non white skin color actually returns some value of the original story and the foreigness of mermaids to the Danish people.

                  While you can argue that the humans in the story are Danes, the mermaids most certainly are not. They are a creature of myth. Plenty of creatures of myth have differing skin color, which contributed to white people believing that dark colored skin meant those people were less than human, centuries ago.

                  Additionally, they are changing the location from of the coast of Europe to the Caribbean. Which makes the racial change make sense as well.

                  ETA: the genie isn't really an issue either, because mythical creature. But. We're talking am Arab country and a genie bottle. Genie was once human. It would be a lot more likely that the genie would be dark skinned, than white. Africans traded with and traveled to the middle east fairly frequently in that time period, if I'm remembering my history correctly.
                  Last edited by Shahaku; 07 Jul 2019, 11:47.
                  We are what we are. Nothing more, nothing less. There is good and evil among every kind of people. It's the evil among us who rule now. -Anne Bishop, Daughter of the Blood

                  I wondered if he could ever understand that it was a blessing, not a sin, to be graced with more than one love.
                  It could be complicated; of course it could be complicated. And it opened one up to the possibility of more pain and loss.
                  Still, it was a blessing I would never relinquish. Love, genuine love, was always a cause for joy.
                  -Jacqueline Carey, Naamah's Curse

                  Service to your fellows is the root of peace.

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                    #24
                    Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                    Originally posted by Shahaku View Post
                    .. Additionally, they are changing the location from of the coast of Europe to the Caribbean. Which makes the racial change make sense as well. ..
                    Then let them make a movie about River Mumma the mermaid of Jamaica who is already a major character of Caribbean lore. Oh wait, that would be an actual Mermaid of Color with a legitimate heritage that could be introduced to people and actually known with legitimate lore of her own. Like I said easier to black wash an existing character than actually do true diversity introduction.
                    I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                      #25
                      Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                      Originally posted by Shahaku View Post
                      Actually, from what I've read, the original little mermaid was green. As in, in the story written by the original author. Since I haven't read the original story myself, I'm not sure if that comes from the story or original artwork. I know the mermaid on the cover of many original copies is green. One thing Disney has attempted with these live action remakes is to incorporate more of the adult themes that they dumbed down or whitewashed from the originals. Giving the little mermaid a non white skin color actually returns some value of the original story and the foreigness of mermaids to the Danish people.

                      While you can argue that the humans in the story are Danes, the mermaids most certainly are not. They are a creature of myth. Plenty of creatures of myth have differing skin color, which contributed to white people believing that dark colored skin meant those people were less than human, centuries ago.

                      Additionally, they are changing the location from of the coast of Europe to the Caribbean. Which makes the racial change make sense as well.

                      ETA: the genie isn't really an issue either, because mythical creature. But. We're talking am Arab country and a genie bottle. Genie was once human. It would be a lot more likely that the genie would be dark skinned, than white. Africans traded with and traveled to the middle east fairly frequently in that time period, if I'm remembering my history correctly.
                      Really don't wanna get tangled in this discussion. But. Her skin is not green. He describes it something like "clear and radiant as a rose petal". No mention of what colour that petal is though (that misunderstanding might come from the statue of her which is green. It's old copper). And while she does have blue eyes in the story... the original story is already so far from the movie, I really don't see the issue. There's no human race to them, they're not human.
                      You remind me of the babe
                      What babe?
                      The babe with the power
                      What power?
                      The Power of voodoo
                      Who do?
                      You do!
                      Do what?
                      Remind me of the babe!

                      Army of Darkness: Guardians of the Chat

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                        #26
                        Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                        Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                        Then let them make a movie about River Mumma the mermaid of Jamaica who is already a major character of Caribbean lore. Oh wait, that would be an actual Mermaid of Color with a legitimate heritage that could be introduced to people and actually known with legitimate lore of her own. Like I said easier to black wash an existing character than actually do true diversity introduction.
                        And you completely overlooked the rest of my post. That was only a side note at the very end.

                        Originally posted by iris View Post
                        Really don't wanna get tangled in this discussion. But. Her skin is not green. He describes it something like "clear and radiant as a rose petal". No mention of what colour that petal is though (that misunderstanding might come from the statue of her which is green. It's old copper). And while she does have blue eyes in the story... the original story is already so far from the movie, I really don't see the issue. There's no human race to them, they're not human.
                        I'm honestly not sure. It's something that came up in a few Facebook discussions I've seen over the last few days. I do know when I Googled it, some of the books with pretty old artwork had green or something like faded teal mermaids on them.
                        We are what we are. Nothing more, nothing less. There is good and evil among every kind of people. It's the evil among us who rule now. -Anne Bishop, Daughter of the Blood

                        I wondered if he could ever understand that it was a blessing, not a sin, to be graced with more than one love.
                        It could be complicated; of course it could be complicated. And it opened one up to the possibility of more pain and loss.
                        Still, it was a blessing I would never relinquish. Love, genuine love, was always a cause for joy.
                        -Jacqueline Carey, Naamah's Curse

                        Service to your fellows is the root of peace.

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                          I think everybody needs to calm down and give the black mermaid a chance.

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                            #28
                            Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                            I personally don't care if Ariel is black, white, asian, native american, or an alien from outer space. I was just stirring the pot.
                            �Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted. And experience is often the most valuable thing you have to offer.�
                            ― Randy Pausch, The Last Lecture
                            Sneak Attack
                            Avatar picture by the wonderful and talented TJSGrimm.

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                              #29
                              Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                              Originally posted by Shahaku View Post
                              And you completely overlooked the rest of my post. That was only a side note at the very end..
                              Honestly no I didn't overlook the rest of your post. I've focused upon the aspect of Ariel as both the Disney version and Hans Christian Anderson's input. In that regard reflection upon the Danish influence which is not painting the merfolk as anything other than being half human and appearing more human in appearance and half fish. One reference suggest silver colored hair but also suggests it might be netting or sea weed of some sort as I've not actually found a clear reference to the youngest daughter's hair nor is she ever given an actual name. But her biggest purpose per Han's Christian Anderson's story is actually the seeking of a human soul through marriage which is somewhat portrayed in the Disney movie. Yet Anderson's Mermaid never achieve's that and is turned into an air spirit and will spend 300 years where she will possibly gain that soul upon doing good deeds at the conclusion of that time helping people. Vice being turned into sea foam like the rest of her mermaid sisters upon the expiration of their 300 year life span.

                              So while there is some strangeness to the Danish lore of the Merfolk the story upon which the Little Mermaid is actually Drawn is more human like in its usage of the merfolk in appearance and relationship to humanity. Where it differ's is the difference between the immortal "soul" between the two which Anderson goes to some length to stress and clarify. A position which is also carried over into the Disney movie as well though not to the extent that the Christian overtones and immortal soul influences are present. Even to the sacrifice that Ariel (youngest daughter) is willing to make to achieve that immortal soul / marriage.

                              That is the heritage that is passed via the movie and Anderson's influence upon it through the Danish story telling. Skin color played no significant role in the story at any point.
                              I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                                #30
                                Re: People Are Making A Big Deal Of A Black Mermaid

                                That's it! I'm sick of feeling attacked. I don't give a crap what color the little mermaid is. I was just saying that it would be nice for them to stick to the traditional. Also, people have their own damned opinions and just because you don't agree does not mean you have to get upset with them. I'm not going to stand by feeling judged by anyone just because I want to speak what I think.
                                Anubisa

                                Dedicated and devoted to Lord Anubis and Lady Bast. A follower of the path of Egyptian Wicca.

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