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    Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

    I was raised in a Christian church where we were taught that all pagans are going to hell, and that anything pagan is from a plot of satan to deceive the world so they will be in hell with him.

    I am at a point of uncertainty now because I don't want this to be true, but at the same time, I can't know for sure.

    Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?

    If so, how did you deal with it? If not, what do you suggest?

    #2
    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

    the more fundamentalist sects of Christianity would have you believe 4 mutually exclusive facts

    1) God is all-powerful

    2) God is all-knowing

    3) God is loves all

    4) God casually sentences people to torment that makes the lifespan of this universe seem like an f***ing eyeblink

    You can have 1, 2, and 3 or you can have 1, 2 and 4. You can't reconcile all four at once. A loving power that has the ability not to sentence people to unending torment for crimes whose repercussions will not last that long generally isn't going to. A tyrranical bastard might but I generally don't consider them benevolent. So if you want an all-knowing, all-powerful god then you've got to pick between 3 and 4. An all-knowing, all-powerful half-decent (let alone omni-benevolent) divinity has better things to do than throw fire and brimstone over matters of faith. Now, you could take 3 and 4 but toss in a god that's either not all-knowing or not all-powerful. I.E. God isn't tossing people into hell casually, he's doing it because he doesn't have a choice unless you play by his rules but then you need to ask yourself wtf is shoving unpleasant rules down the throat of the LoH since Christian theology doesn't account for such a thing.
    life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

    Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

    "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

    John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

    "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

    Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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      #3
      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

      I can't say I was ever afraid of it, because frankly I never believed in it.

      As a way to deal with a fear of that I'd suggest just simply be a good person and if there is a judgement after death, maybe your god will be as "loving" as they claim and forgive.

      Because judging someone simply on beliefs and not actions is idiotic even for a god.
      To be honest, if I was judged badly for not believing, then his heaven is not somewhere I'd want to be.
      "The fire could not be tamed with the wind,
      nor the wind suppressed by the flames.
      As blending the Light with the Dark
      merely results in Grey." -Ville Friman

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        #4
        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

        Well this path is calling me. I am trying to get beyond the warnings from modern conservative American Christianity that it is a path of evil and darkness.

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          #5
          Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

          Certain portions of modern Christianity would have you believe the universe is created by a genocidal maniac with a hard on for inflicting agony. If they're right then we're all f***ed anyway. If not,

          "I do not believe the same God that endowed me with intellect, meant that I should refuse to use it."

          Yes, I'm butchering the quote but the premise stands.
          life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

          Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

          "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

          John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

          "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

          Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


          Comment


            #6
            Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

            Originally posted by Yoey View Post
            Well this path is calling me. I am trying to get beyond the warnings from modern conservative American Christianity that it is a path of evil and darkness.
            I assume you mean a pagan path is calling you?
            IF that's what you meant, then yeah almost none of them are paths of evil by any stretch.

            It all depends on who you are. There are some people who explicitly practice black magic simply because they couldn't care less about the consequences.
            But 9 times out of 10 you won't meet someone like that.
            "The fire could not be tamed with the wind,
            nor the wind suppressed by the flames.
            As blending the Light with the Dark
            merely results in Grey." -Ville Friman

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

              Hell has no power over me, since I don't fear it.

              The conclusion that paganism is not an evil practice is one you will have to make for yourself. This forum is a valuable resource.

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?

                If so, how did you deal with it? If not, what do you suggest?
                It's useful to read up on the psychology of religion, this cuts right through the dogma and really makes you question all forms of religion, especially the dogmatic ones.

                Why does Christianity have the rules it does? - this is really worth looking into.

                Try some Nietzsche, especially 'Beyond Good and Evil' , and 'The Antichrist'

                don't be put off by the titles.

                The books are a revealing psychological examination of Christianity, and is a real eye opener for one who is having lingering thoughts over the possibility of the Bible being fact.

                Why would Yawheh give mankind animal lusts to procreate, then fashion a marriage system through a collection of priests and churches as the only way to create a child?

                Why would God create his chosen race of people (the Jews) and then step back while Hitler committed his evil against them?

                Why are most Republican Conservative Christians so hateful of the poor, Obama and anything vaguely socially minded? (the opposite of the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles)

                Many questions here that seriously challenge the biblical dogma.

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                  #9
                  Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                  When I was a Catholic I was in fear of going to Hell.
                  I got rid of that notion as soon as I became an atheist.
                  Problem solved.
                  Satan is my spirit animal

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                    I was raised Christian as well, so I know how you feel. Supposedly, anything that doesn't follow the Bible is "Satan's work". And there were a lot of things in the Bible that I didn't agree with. I just stayed Agnostic for a while, believing that there was something powerful out there, but not feeling comfortable with the belief of a Christian god. Pretty much, according to Christians, not believing in the Christian god, or not believing any god at all are just as bad as worshiping Satan.
                    Eventually I stumbled upon Paganism. It went along almost perfectly with everything I already believed in. It just makes the most sense to me. So why should I be afraid of heaven and hell anymore? I don't even believe that exists anymore.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                      Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                      I was raised in a Christian church where we were taught that all pagans are going to hell, and that anything pagan is from a plot of satan to deceive the world so they will be in hell with him.

                      I am at a point of uncertainty now because I don't want this to be true, but at the same time, I can't know for sure.

                      Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?

                      If so, how did you deal with it? If not, what do you suggest?
                      As I researched more about Wicca and Paganism when I started out, none of it told me that it was satanic, evil, or destructive. None of it felt like it was hurting anyone, including myself. The Christian concept of a vengeful God and eternal damnation never made sense to me, so I never truly believed it. I never have, and therefore I'm not afraid of it.
                      I would suggest that you read more on Paganism (or Wicca, or whatever path you're interested in) and just think about it and make your decision accordingly. Right now it sounds that you're really unsure. No one can tell you what's right for you, only you can find that. The simplest thing I can recommend is studying up on the topic and going from there.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                        Christianity has some funny ideas. Do you know that Lucifer really means 'Light bringer'?

                        Personally I get more worried about the hell that people construct here on earth than anything else. As for God - with the actions of some people who claim to believe in him, well, if I were God I would be bloody annoyed
                        www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                        Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                          #13
                          Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                          I laid out the possibilities and evaluated them...the threat of Hell is pretty silly (but understandable, depending on one's upbringing).

                          If it turn out, in some quirk of the cosmos, that the Christians are right there are two possibilities.
                          Possibility A:
                          The Fundie Christians are right, only the Saved go to heaven, everyone else burns. Considering there are some 38,000+ Christian denominations, how are they to figure out which one is right? If most of them weren't so self-righteous (in direct conflict with what Jesus has said) about their beliefs, they'd realize they can't all be right if the god they profess to believe in is really God AND go to Heaven...one little step of their tiny little path, one little deviation from the tiny little box they've placed god into, and its Hell time! How limited and powerless must such a god be, so vengeful and angry....nothing like a god I would want to waste my time and my life worshiping! A god like that is not worthy of ME!! In which case, I would rather burn in hell with the likes of Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Thomas Jefferson, Marie Curie, and billions of other interesting and intelligent people that have done good things for humanity than worship some abusive parent deity

                          Possibility B:

                          I grew up in a fairly Universalist Christian denomination (and a fairly progressive and liberal one as well)...so this is the idea I was raised with--unlike you, Hell was never a threat I took seriously, because we were taught that Hell is a construct of the Catholic church and the idea of being "saved" is a construct of modern Fundamentalism (two ideas you might find worthy of looking into). I think I am mostly a "good" person, and for the times that I am not, it is usually justified.


                          ************************************


                          Reincarnation of some sort.
                          I like life. I like living. This is pretty much a cool option, unless the next life is a slug or something squishy and gross. I mean, one lifetime is not enough to do EVERYTHING, so a second (to infinity and beyond!) shot is pretty neat.



                          Summerlands/Elysian Fields/Parallel Universe/other afterlife
                          I am also down with this. I feel that the afterlife (should there be one) should be of your choice and choosing dependent upon your actions and deserving. Kind of like buying a pair of shoes. I choose the shoes I like, and if I have been a good girl, and saved my pennies, I might be able to afford them.

                          There is no afterlife. When you die, you die. Your body rots (unless it is embalmed) and you become worm food. Full stop.



                          ************************************

                          Life is the business of the living, death is the business of the dead.When you fear something, you give it power
                          Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
                          sigpic

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                            #14
                            Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                            Since Christianity is base on Judaism and they have no concept like Hell, I have no idea where this comes into play other than the new testament. I also think IF there is a hell it's for Christians who have done their god some violation.

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                              #15
                              Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                              I suggest reading this if you still have a fear of hell: http://biblelight.net/hell.htm

                              To summarize, they quote verses of the bible describing death and hell. This is only your first death and it is no different than going to sleep for a long long time. At some point, the resurrection will happen and all souls will be brought back to earth and will be judged on the actions they take then. At that point, it will be decided if they spend eternal life with god or are thrown into the fire. And it is the consequences of the fire that are eternal, not the fire itself, you're body and soul, everything about you, will be eaten up by the fire and you will no longer exist. These are conclusions drawn directly from the bible and the article describes it in much more detail. Basically, there is no point in fearing hell now and when there is it isn't a permanent thing and it is done in degrees.

                              I came across this information from a Jehovah Witness friend when I was breaking ties with the Christian church and dogma. I don't think they would have so readily told me this if they had realized they were relieving the main fear that was still holding me to the church but... ah well.
                              We are what we are. Nothing more, nothing less. There is good and evil among every kind of people. It's the evil among us who rule now. -Anne Bishop, Daughter of the Blood

                              I wondered if he could ever understand that it was a blessing, not a sin, to be graced with more than one love.
                              It could be complicated; of course it could be complicated. And it opened one up to the possibility of more pain and loss.
                              Still, it was a blessing I would never relinquish. Love, genuine love, was always a cause for joy.
                              -Jacqueline Carey, Naamah's Curse

                              Service to your fellows is the root of peace.

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