Is worship necessary?

[Jembru]

Re: Is worship necessary?

This came up while I was too busy with my studies to take time to reply, but I have dipped in and out. It has been very interesting. I don't have much to offer that others haven't already said, and probably more eloquently than I could put it. I do think the OP, at least FROM their OP , appeared to have a definition of 'worship' that is a little different to some of the definitions I have heard from pagans (including my own understanding of the word).

For me, I don't worship because I think my gods will get angry with me if I don't. In fact, on several occasions, my gods have shown a loyalty and devotion to ME that I probably didn't deserve. I think, for example, to the way Brigantia appeared to come after me and bring me home when I moved to Germany, home not just to England, but literally home to my Self. Or how I'll pray to them at my dusty, altar with its decorations from 7 sabbats ago (I was exaggerating but actually not THAT far out.. I've just checked and it is dressed for Imbolc.. I did my ritual for Mabon in the living at the hearth!), and yet they'll instantly come to my aid. So at least the deities I worship, don't appear to have a 'tit-for-tat attitude when it comes to demanding observation from me.

Why do I worship? It's kinda selfish actually. I worship because it feels good to. I enjoy the pleasure it brings into my life to believe I have a relationship with divine beings. I enjoy feeling connected to something bigger than myself. I worship my deities for the exact same reason I tell JP I love him whenever I can, and hug him on the sofa, why I kiss him as we pass each other in the morning and why I slip between the sheets with him when we both have a night, or day off work. I do it because it feels good to love and be loved in return and I feel stronger, more enriched by the experience. I never even consider that my actions may or may not get me into some kind of after life. I'm not really one to plan for the future anyway and besides, after some of the things I've done between those sheets.. tee hee hee..

[Unus Mundus]

Re: Is worship necessary?

-snip-

I have to agree with this so much (and also through in my own point)!

I worship not out of fear of retribution, or not getting what I want, but because I have a genuine love and respect for the deities I worship. I see them sort of as a family of beings that surrounds me in ways, and watches over me at times, and let's me take the fall during others.

In my case, they have also forgiven me in ways I didn't think they ever would. Even recently, my faith was tested greatly, and for a long time I neither worshiped or really believed in the gods, or anything out there. I was very disconnected and just tired of it, but slowly I came back to it, and Brigit especially gave me time to see the mistakes I had made myself, and that they weren't caused by the lack of intervention of the divine, or some twisted path of fate. I came back and asked for forgiveness, and not only was I given that, but I was given much love...

Maybe its just me, but that's why I worship anyway, it isn't to throw myself down onto the floor and beg, or to desire riches or wealth, it is love beyond what just "is."

So to answer finally, no I don't think worship is neccesary, but I think it makes the person "better" if done correctly, and builds a relationship with the spirits, the land, the gods, your ancestors, and so much more. It builds a web of life and wonder around you, that you must only pay attention to, to see (is worship necessary to see this, no, but I think it helps).

To me, worship is a vehicle to happiness, love, growth, learning, tranquility, and if you want, connection to the divine. Worship can be formal, at an altar praying with sacrifices of bread and wine, or as informal as looking up at the night sky in awe of it all, a feeling of love towards other life, helping others, or pondering human existence.

Even if I held no deities in esteem, or was atheist, I would worship, just worship the universe in general by my admiration and love of it.

[jcaternolo]

Re: Is worship necessary?

I think the only thing a god/goddess wants is for us to pray to them once in a while (or regularly, it depends on who you're working with) to let them know how you're doing, and of course, to come to them with any questions/concerns. I think of a god/goddess as a parent who wants what's best for their child.

What a god/goddess doesn't want is for us to only come to them when we need help, praying to them is basically letting them know that you still respect and love them. Your earth parents would want you to write them or call them every once in a while, it's the same with gods/goddesses

[DanieMarie]

Re: Is worship necessary?

I just came upon this thread and am reading some of the comments.

I've never really felt comfortable with the idea of "worship." I always felt better showing honor and respect. Sort of like I'd show respect for someone important in my physical life, but on a larger scale.

Reading a couple of the responses in this thread, I'd like to point out that the OP lists his religion as "Buddhist." A lot of forms of Buddhism don't involve worship, so that could describe some of his feelings (possibly).

[SaintElvis]

Re: Is worship necessary?

Buddhism itself has no gods. Buddhist Sects and Cultural regions have incorporated gods into Buddhist Practices. Pure Buddhism itself contains no gods.

As for the OP: Worship- What does it mean to you?

[Tarn]

Re: Is worship necessary?

Maybe you confuse "worship" with being thankful.

Coming from a background based entirely in "Christianity", I know all to well how worship is required. In fact that was one of the reasons that I could never follow Yahweh, or "God". I always wondered why a loving and kind god would have to order you to worship him?

I tend to equate "worship" of any Deity to the way a child "worships" a parent. And this is not meant to lessen any Deity; it is just easier for me to understand it this way. Few children actually worship their parents; but they do appreciate them. When a child is hungry, they turn to their parents for food. When they need most anything: comfort; guidance; shelter; toys; love, they turn to their parents. My children never came to me and lit a red candle and asked me to heal a skinned knee; but they did bring several skinned knees and elbows, and a plethora of other cuts and lacerations to me for mending. Maybe they were making a "Blood offering" to me, who knows. My kids turned to me, and their mom, for their needs and wants. In return, they gave us love and did things to appease us, as it were. They did things to show their love for us and to show that the did appreciate what we did for them (most of the time).

To me, worship is not the "You vill worship me, und like it!" type of "giving thanks". It is more of simply giving thanks to the Deity. While I do perform a "ritual" to honor my Goddess; I also will take a moment at anytime during the day to stop and simply say "Thanks for... ". This does not fit well into the idea of "Worship"; and that is not what I feel that I'm doing. Yet at the same time, I am. I am showing my appreciation to my Goddess, which is, in a way, worship. Yet I'm not groveling before her like a trained slave.

With my Christian upbringing, I have had to "un-learn" a few ideas. And worship was one of them. I had to learn that very, very few traditions, pantheons, beliefs, paths, etc., require worship. I have learned that it is simply showing your gratitude to your Deity that really matters. From something as simple as thinking about my Goddess and telling Her "Thanks", to making a special offering for Her and presenting it to her at the altar; kind of like a birthday, or mother's day party. I know this may sound like I'm minimizing Her; but that is not my intent. I'm just trying to view my relationship with Her in a realistic perspective. I don't believe that She wants me to cower and grovel at her feet. But I do believe that She likes it when I stop and say "Thanks", or when I offer her fresh coffee and flowers (Cosmos) on the altar.

So is my relaxed way of giving thanks worship? Some would say yes, and some would say no.

I think that you, like I did, have the idea that worship is required. It is something that you MUST do if it is warranted or not. And I, like you seem to be, rebelled against that idea. So, defining worship as an act that is required no matter what... I agree with you. But to define worship as the act of showing graduated to your Deity, then I am quite willing to "worship" in that light.

Someone told me that they "bribed" their Deity. Sounds horrible, doesn't it? But what they meant was that they made some offerings as a way to "butter them up". Kind of like giving the teacher an apple. Not that their Goddess was corrupt; but that She liked "little gifts" and that She would usually acknowledge the favor. After thinking about it for a while I realized that most anyone enjoys a little surprise favor from time to time; so why wouldn't a Deity enjoy it too? This was his way of "worshiping" Her, in addition to more traditional forms of worship, or giving honor and thanks to Her.

May I suggest that you take some time and think about what "worship" means to you? Is it more of a required act than it is an act of your own free will? Is worship different from simply giving thanks? Understand how you define "worship". Then consider if that is what you want to do. Or would another word be appropriate? Maybe try thinking of worship as thanking, or honoring your Deity.

Hope this helps you look at this from a different view point. Sometimes that is all one needs to see the answer.

[Alienist]

Re: Is worship necessary?

I think worship is or at least supposed to mean showing thanks and honoring deities. However corrupt people in the past I think twisted it and made it as if you're a heretic or bad person if you didn't bow down to their deity or deities. That kind of worship is more like slavery than showing honor which is what it's really supposed to be. You're showing honor and thanking the deity or deities for helping you, not just blindly submitting them and not question their methods. A good deity would not want someone to submit. The deities of most religions are supposed to be teachers and guides to help you lead a better moral life. You'd think a greedy or bad deity would want someone to submit. The Hindu, Greek, Egyptian, Taoist, and Heathen Pantehon as well as Ahura Mazda, Yahweh and others like The Buddha or Jesus are there to help you. They want to teach you knew things, avoid sin, and so that you would be welcome to their abode.

[Satu]

Re: Is worship necessary?

The deities of most religions are supposed to be teachers and guides to help you lead a better moral life. You'd think a greedy or bad deity would want someone to submit. The Hindu, Greek, Egyptian, Taoist, and Heathen Pantehon as well as Ahura Mazda, Yahweh and others like The Buddha or Jesus are there to help you. They want to teach you knew things, avoid sin, and so that you would be welcome to their abode.

That's one way to look at it. From another perspective, deities aren't here to serve us as teachers and guides. They are not divine hand-holders. Sure, a lot of them don't mind it. More than a few of them seem more than happy to help in exchange for--guess what?--worship. But there's an ongoing exchange, and some of them do want submission. What submission means depends on the context. It doesn't necessarily mean losing all individuality or freedom. More often, submission seems to encompass trusting that deity and giving Him or Her your love and worship. For Kemetics, that might mean "walking on god's water" and placing oneself "in god's hand". It's acknowledging that the gods have a very powerful effect on your life. On the other hand, you are still ultimately responsible for your own behavior.

I think you're conflating religious institutions with deity. Yes, a lot of corrupt people twist their religion to fit their own needs, and those needs are often not very good. But that doesn't necessarily reflect on the deity. For example, Akhenaten reformed ancient Egyptian religion to a revealed monotheism. Nobody had access to his uber-god, Aten. Everyone had to pray to Akhenaten. Here you have a corrupt individual who twisted his country's religion to fit his agenda and did a crapload of harm in the process. So does that mean Aten is a monotheistic deity? Does Aten demand you worship only Him/It and no one else? No. There is nothing outside of the Amarna period that indicates Aten is a jealous god. In fact, pre-Amarna Aten was just another Netjer out of many, linked with the various sun gods in the traditional format.