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Thread: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

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    Sr. Member Ouranos Ouroboros's Avatar
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    rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    I've been reading the Elder Futhark runes for several years now, and I'm in the process of learning the tree-ogam (or, I suppose, the most famous one in modern times). I have a good idea about general spreads from various divination practices, although I'm always open to suggestions. I am, however, particularly interested in spreads that utilize spatial elements of the runes and/or ogamfews (especially the latter, as I'm new to it). Please let me know if you have any ideas on the subject.

    [I'm really sorry, but I posted this thinking I had already clicked the button to enter the divination sub-forum. Please move this if necessary and accept my apology.]
    OO

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    Opinionated Rae'ya's Avatar
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    Re: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    Can you clarify what you mean by 'spatial elements'? I don't have anything to do with ogham but I am a runecaster... and I 'cast' in the sense of dropping them onto a mat rather than laying them out using constructed layouts. When you say 'spatial elements' the first thing that jumps into my mind is the way that I read runes, where the meanings are influenced by their positions not only on the mat but in relation to each other. This wouldn't necessarily be what you mean if you're talking about staves laid out in a formulated pattern, though.

    Just want to make sure we're talking about the same thing before I go off on a tangent

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    Sr. Member Ouranos Ouroboros's Avatar
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    Re: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    Feel free to get tangential. Even if it isn't specifically what I was looking for, I'm sure it will be interesting.


    I'm really talking about any spatial element that might be introduced into a spread. I'm open to pretty much any ideas. I sometimes put runes into set patterns, but I also sometimes cast them freely and look (chiefly) for their juxtapositions to be determined by the lines that are on the same plane. If, for instance, the central line of algiz/elhaz lined up with one of the lines of kenaz in the context of career, I might ask the seeker (aka querent) if they have considered being a firefighter or just taking a high-pressure job where they were metaphorically under fire a lot.
    OO

    Book of Spirals is my author site.
    The Sentient Hillside is my blog.
    Spiral Tree is an ezine for pagans I co-founded.

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    Opinionated Rae'ya's Avatar
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    Re: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    The thing with spatial elements is that it will depend entirely on the mat format that you use, or whether you use any format at all. I knew a person who read the runes as a spiral from the inside of the casting outwards, in a sort of linear progression of relationship between each one. Whereas a person who uses a formatted mat will have techniques and patterns that are specific to that particular format which just don't translate well to other mats.

    This is the way I read, which is completely specific to my current mat. When I make my new rune mat then there will probably be changes to the way I read based on the new format. To me the two are intrinsically linked. I use that as a caveat because my way will not necessarily work on another mat or for another person and cannot just be transplanted from one to another. But maybe it will give you some inspiration...

    My current mat is divided into sections based on directional/elemental/sphere of influence quadrants along with crux, solution/blockages and influences. The directional thing is arbitrary and is loosely based on the the typical neo-pagan directional correspondences flipped around for the Southern Hemisphere. The specifics of the energy of each quadrant is highly dependent on the theme or question of the cast... a cast about finance will put different meanings in each 'direction' than a cast about relationships. I do line the directions up with the actual directions, using a compass. I think I have an old picture of the format around here somewhere...
    Casting mat.jpg
    In which section each rune lands has a major impact on the significance of that rune, while runes that land directly on lines or boundaries will depend on which way it is facing or 'moving'. The rune or runes in the 'Crux' section are what is at the centre of the issue, or most relevant to the question. The further towards the edge of the mat, the less impact the rune has on the casting. Anything that falls off the mat is irrelevant. Runes that fall facedown are myrkr and represent hidden or unknown influences... how significant they are depends on which section they are in and their position in relation to everything else. A myrkr rune in the 'Crux' section is just as important as a the faceup one in that section, it's just that it's hidden, unknown or working more from the background. Myrkr runes are not bad, negative or 'reversed'... to me the runespirit is the runespirit and it is just as multifaceted, complex and dynamic as a person is. I don't divide it up between 'good' and 'bad' or 'upright' and 'reversed'... that just doesn't gel with me and it's not the relationship that I have with the runes.

    Otherwise where each rune lands in relation to each other is what I read, and are just as important as which section they are in. Runes grouped closely together are read as a single unit, and if they are touching then there is special significance between them, which could be a beneficial or negative aspecting depending on the angles and area that they landed. For runes that are not in obvious little close groups, I roughly base the relationships on the angles between them, as measured through the centre of the mat. Runes that are at distinct right angles to each other are in opposition or stasis with each other. Runes that are at acute angles are working in cooperation, while runes at obtuse angles are working harmoniously. Runes directly across from each other are in direct conflict.

    My rune readings tend to be a number of pages long and are... complex lol. It can take hours to really get all the nuances that the runespirits are communicating, and I always revisit an important casting a few days later to see if I missed anything. Sometimes the readings are simple and to the point, and sometimes there are layers of messages to be drawn out and interpreted.

  5. #5
    Sr. Member Ouranos Ouroboros's Avatar
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    Re: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rae'ya View Post
    The thing with spatial elements is that it will depend entirely on the mat format that you use, or whether you use any format at all. I knew a person who read the runes as a spiral from the inside of the casting outwards, in a sort of linear progression of relationship between each one. Whereas a person who uses a formatted mat will have techniques and patterns that are specific to that particular format which just don't translate well to other mats.

    This is the way I read, which is completely specific to my current mat. When I make my new rune mat then there will probably be changes to the way I read based on the new format. To me the two are intrinsically linked. I use that as a caveat because my way will not necessarily work on another mat or for another person and cannot just be transplanted from one to another. But maybe it will give you some inspiration...

    My current mat is divided into sections based on directional/elemental/sphere of influence quadrants along with crux, solution/blockages and influences. The directional thing is arbitrary and is loosely based on the the typical neo-pagan directional correspondences flipped around for the Southern Hemisphere. The specifics of the energy of each quadrant is highly dependent on the theme or question of the cast... a cast about finance will put different meanings in each 'direction' than a cast about relationships. I do line the directions up with the actual directions, using a compass. I think I have an old picture of the format around here somewhere...

    In which section each rune lands has a major impact on the significance of that rune, while runes that land directly on lines or boundaries will depend on which way it is facing or 'moving'. The rune or runes in the 'Crux' section are what is at the centre of the issue, or most relevant to the question. The further towards the edge of the mat, the less impact the rune has on the casting. Anything that falls off the mat is irrelevant. Runes that fall facedown are myrkr and represent hidden or unknown influences... how significant they are depends on which section they are in and their position in relation to everything else. A myrkr rune in the 'Crux' section is just as important as a the faceup one in that section, it's just that it's hidden, unknown or working more from the background. Myrkr runes are not bad, negative or 'reversed'... to me the runespirit is the runespirit and it is just as multifaceted, complex and dynamic as a person is. I don't divide it up between 'good' and 'bad' or 'upright' and 'reversed'... that just doesn't gel with me and it's not the relationship that I have with the runes.

    Otherwise where each rune lands in relation to each other is what I read, and are just as important as which section they are in. Runes grouped closely together are read as a single unit, and if they are touching then there is special significance between them, which could be a beneficial or negative aspecting depending on the angles and area that they landed. For runes that are not in obvious little close groups, I roughly base the relationships on the angles between them, as measured through the centre of the mat. Runes that are at distinct right angles to each other are in opposition or stasis with each other. Runes that are at acute angles are working in cooperation, while runes at obtuse angles are working harmoniously. Runes directly across from each other are in direct conflict.

    My rune readings tend to be a number of pages long and are... complex lol. It can take hours to really get all the nuances that the runespirits are communicating, and I always revisit an important casting a few days later to see if I missed anything. Sometimes the readings are simple and to the point, and sometimes there are layers of messages to be drawn out and interpreted.
    Actually, you've mentioned several techniques that I'll consider incorporating into my rune readings.


    Do you read movement as well as sections? For instance, I think, if I use a template like this, that I'll see it as moving in a spiral from east deosil around to center and probably interpret some runes based on that movement.


    Do you read north as being associated with earth or ice?


    Would myrkr staves also be called murkstaves or do you consider them to be in a separate category? For instance, I tend to read runes as "normal," murkstaved or crossed/ interrupted, but I've never used myrkr runes (unless they're the same as murkstaves/ merkstaves).


    Thanks for sharing this. I'll save it for my (crazy, badly-written, multi-volume, partially electronic and entirely messy) Book of Shadows.
    OO

    Book of Spirals is my author site.
    The Sentient Hillside is my blog.
    Spiral Tree is an ezine for pagans I co-founded.

  6. #6
    Opinionated Rae'ya's Avatar
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    Re: rune and ogam spatial spreads?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ouranos Ouroboros View Post
    Do you read movement as well as sections? For instance, I think, if I use a template like this, that I'll see it as moving in a spiral from east deosil around to center and probably interpret some runes based on that movement.
    I don't read movement in the sense that you've mentioned here, but I do recognise runes that are on borders or 'pointing' in a particular direction. Patterns sometimes pop up which suggest a more dynamic interplay of the runes involved, but that's a very individual sort of thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ouranos Ouroboros View Post
    Do you read north as being associated with earth or ice?
    For me North is fire, because I'm in the Southern Hemisphere and that's the direction of the equator... the further north you go, the hotter it gets lol.

    My current rune mat does not recognise ice as a separate element, but as a sub-type of water. That's something that I'm in the process of revising though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ouranos Ouroboros View Post
    Would myrkr staves also be called murkstaves or do you consider them to be in a separate category? For instance, I tend to read runes as "normal," murkstaved or crossed/ interrupted, but I've never used myrkr runes (unless they're the same as murkstaves/ merkstaves).
    The terms themselves are all the same... myrkr is the Old Norse spelling. It means 'dark' in the sense of dark, gloomy, hidden, obscured etc

    The difference is in the way that people interpret the terms. Lots of people think that myrkr runes are the negative side of runes, kind of like reversed tarot cards. And so they see a rune upside down in a cast and read it as the negative/harmful/bad side of the rune. I don't subscribe to that way of thinking (not even for tarot cards). So to me the a myrkr rune is one that is hidden or unknown... obscured by the darkness... it's face down and you can't see it, but it's still on the mat and still working away there in the background.

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