Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[Chalice]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=perzephone link=topic=108.msg25273#msg25273 date=1293542935]
Instead of making broad statements like that, why don't you go over some of the specific points that you disagree with from your own perspective and experiences? Maybe give us all who aren't Satanists some varying points of view?
[/quote]

I won't without permission of Medusa.this is her topic.

[Lane Trip]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

Well if it would be okay with Medusa, I think we could turn this thread into a LaVey and Spiritual/Theistic Satanist thread as to cover both spectrums. Or Chalice you could start your own thread. I have actually taken an interest in Spiritual Satanism so I think a thread for it or adding it to this thread would be good.

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=Chalice link=topic=108.msg25295#msg25295 date=1293548771]
I won't without permission of Medusa.this is her topic.
[/quote]
I think you are totally free to post here as a reply. But to be clear, maybe starting your own thread would do us some good too. Since like I stated, I am not a Theistic Satanist. And as an Atheist it's very hard for me to answer deity inspired questions.


*as a side note....
As for Joy of Satan? It's a racist Nazi loving piece of yahoo shit. Good luck.

[Chalice]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=Medusa link=topic=108.msg25400#msg25400 date=1293603247]
I think you are totally free to post here as a reply. But to be clear, maybe starting your own thread would do us some good too. Since like I stated, I am not a Theistic Satanist. And as an Atheist it's very hard for me to answer deity inspired questions.


*as a side note....
As for Joy of Satan? It's a racist Nazi loving piece of yahoo shit. Good luck.
[/quote]

Ok I'll start a new thread.

oh and about Joy of Satan, yeah I started there and JoS had an important role in opening my eyes but I never followed them after what I found out about Salem Burke, a High Priestess of JoS and other facts about JoS and for some time I had problems with JoS struggling with them on their Yahoo Group.at last I left it in disgust but their website information is helpful for some spiritual satanists however now I have better resources.I am a Freelance Spiritual Satanist or as some say an Ancient Pagan.

[Lane Trip]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

OK, like I said I would in my other thread, I am going to give my opinion on LaVey's teachings from the Satanic Bible.

First of all I want to state that I did find it inspiring. It definitely made me think about a lot of different things about life any myself. I found it most inspiring to be myself more and not be afraid of what others will think or do. But at the same time I do have a few issues with LaVey.

The main issue I have is that I think he takes his teachings too much to the extreme. Example: He says you should take revenge on those who harm you and never turn the other cheek. Well sometimes I can see that. Sometimes people need to people taught a lesson so that they won't keep on doing the same to other people and harming even more. But sometimes turning the other cheek is better. Sometimes getting revenge over something, usually something petty, just causes more problems. Because the other person retaliates back and it just becomes an endless cycle of revenge that could have easily been avoided had you just been mature and walked away from the situation.

And the biggest thing I have an issue with is the whole indulgence thing. I do agree that yes, you should enjoy things in life and not make yourself miserable trying to follow some religious moral code and ethic. But I think he takes it to far. I know he touches on responsiblity a bit but don't think he does it enough. So many people could just indulge in eating, drinking, and even drugs. Which wouldnt lead to happiness, just addiction and death, or alienation from friends and family because your indulgence becomes a problem. And he seemed to dislike anyone with any sort of religious discipline, and I disagree with that. I admire the Buddhists monks and other strong religious people for their discipline. It takes true strength to have will power like that. LaVey talks about being strong, but any weak fool can indulge, it takes strength and will power to discipline one's self.

Over all, he does make some good points but I do have issues with LaVey. I pointed out the main ones because I think you see my point. But the Satanic Bible is a good read and will make you think. I would definitely recommend it to be read.

And for me personally, I just can't be atheist. I have seen and felt too many things that I just can't ignore. I currently am polytheistic but don't have a set path yet. Currently taken interest in Spiritual/Theistic Satanism.

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

The main issue I have is that I think he takes his teachings too much to the extreme.

Yes. I can agree with this. He was an extreme man. It's up to you (the Satanist) to think for yourself and draw your own limits and comfort zones.

Now about turning the other cheek. There are may times when I have done just that. And...many times when I have not. The thing about being a Satanist is this..it's your choice. There is no technical right or wrong, no sin or virtue when it comes to your actions. You are the individual responsible for your actions. Not LaVey.

As for indulgences? People who merely read the Satanic Bible and stop at that are bound to get the wrong idea. Indulgence is tempered with 100% responsibility. You stated he touches upon it. Well...it's one book. The paragraph below will touch upon that.

Something that people may not get when reading through The Satanic Bible. It's a book. With pages. Satanism lives beyond that book. It's all the other stuff that gets expanded upon that matters. The Satanic Bible is a book about Satanism. It is not however, Satanism en total.

LaVey talks about being strong, but any weak fool can indulge, it takes strength and will power to discipline one's self.

But it takes a Satanist to indulge and be disciplined.

[magusphredde]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=Medusa link=topic=108.msg25564#msg25564 date=1293663014] But it takes a Satanist to indulge and be disciplined.
[/quote]I think I will indulge in some cinnamon pudding cake ... But just one small slice ... For now ... 8)

[Lane Trip]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

OK, I think I get it a bit more now. Thanks for clarifying a bit more Medusa. I am very fascinated by Satanism and in a way might actually consider myself that right now. But I would consider myself a form of Theistic Satanist because I am polytheistic and do see Satan as a god.

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=Lane Trip link=topic=108.msg25627#msg25627 date=1293677961]
OK, I think I get it a bit more now. Thanks for clarifying a bit more Medusa. I am very fascinated by Satanism and in a way might actually consider myself that right now. But I would consider myself a form of Theistic Satanist because I am polytheistic and do see Satan as a god.
[/quote]
Take your time. As they say..there is a pot for every lid.

[Dez]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

Ok, hun, I read Satanic Witch. There are a ton of comments I want to make, questions to ask, etc, but its too much to ask pf my phone(and I'm trying to find a quote and my little phone kindle app is not cooperating)

So, for the moment I wanted to say thank you so much for suggesting it! More to follow soon!

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=Deseret link=topic=108.msg25741#msg25741 date=1293723407]
Ok, hun, I read Satanic Witch. There are a ton of comments I want to make, questions to ask, etc, but its too much to ask pf my phone(and I'm trying to find a quote and my little phone kindle app is not cooperating)

So, for the moment I wanted to say thank you so much for suggesting it! More to follow soon!
[/quote]
I am glad to hear you enjoyed the book. I am looking forward to any questions on it.

[Dez]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

Ok, here we go. I *still* can't find the quote I was thinking of, and so I'm kicking myself for not highlighting it. Maybe on my second read-through I'll catch it and ask. Oh, boy, do I have a story for you, though.

First, I have to say I'm impressed by the things Lavey pulls off by sheer confidence and force of personality. Holy cats. The fact that the man is long dead, and can be that charismatic, even if you totally disagree with what he's saying. It seemed to me as though the most valuable advice he gave wasn't "magic" in any way, shape or form, but pragmatics, with a flare for the dramatic. It also seemed like the really valuable stuff wasn't dressed up, but simply things that he had noticed as a result of his experiences in life. Sometimes, it even feels a bit as though he says things to throw off people who don't continue to use their brains, who would eat up every little thing he's saying. Would you say that's an accurate assessment, or would you disagree?

I'm still rather confused about the clock. It seems like a useful tool, especially to "pin" someone you've only just met. However, it falls apart with people I know well. On the other side, though, it seems helpful if you are trying to create a stereotyped image of yourself.

I think one of the most helpful things for me, was that I hit a point where I realized that in feeling like I can't express myself unless I'm goth-ish, etc, etc...I've been swimming upstream. Everyone always tells me how "sweet" and "cute" I am, and that's exactly what I keep trying to throw right out the window. There are other ways for me to feed my interest in the dark and unusual, things like a future profession choice, or the sort of people I let myself feel attracted to. Right now, though, in small town Idaho, a sort of 50's housewife image can open doors in a way nothing else possibly could.

So, I decided to put it to the test, using my local LDS ward as guinea pigs. We've had multiple discussions about the patriarchal nature of that setting, so this ought to make sense. I've been to this ward twice since we moved: the first time, I wore pants and a sweater (pants for women are a big no-no), and the second time in an unusual, slightly steampunkish outfit. Except for a woman in female leadership, who's job it is to get to know new members, no one spoke to me, because I was rebelling against expected norms. No one asked me if we were new, and even she didn't make sure someone visited, called, etc, like she was supposed to. Totally cold.

After reading this, I was curious.

So last week, I went to sacrament meeting with the kids. I took extra care with my hair and makeup, but didn't scrub myself to death, or wear heavy perfume. I wore a pink blouse, with a little black, lacy tank that peeked out if I leaned over to far, and a skirt that was longer then standard, but has a habit of pulling up underneath my legs if I move around on the bench taking care of my kids. Little kitten heels. Little choker pearl necklace. I felt ridiculous, leaving the house.

Soo....sat in church, third row from the front. Didn't take the sacrament(don't really see a reason to), but my kids took it. True to form, the dance that always happens, and that I always fought tooth and nail before, took place, and my shirt got tugged on, and my skirt pulled up in back, etc, etc.

Two members of the bishopric, and three "helpful and concerned" men from the congregation came up to me at various times while I was getting my kids ready to leave. The Ward Clerk played the "I MUST have met you, and just don't remember your name!" card, and the bishop took my hand and offered me sympathy that it "must be so hard" to have a husband who works so much, and for me not to worry if that means I can't make it to church every week, he completely understood. Etc, etc, ad nausium, from 5 different, yet astonishingly predictable men.

A little, very well-trained part of me felt like the biggest bitch on the planet. The rest of me felt more vindication from that one experience then any amount of slacks-wearing could ever provide.

Medusa, thank you for that. In a strange way, it was extremely healing for me.

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

The most important lesson I learned was the idea of inventing yourself. Off the path of this...Marilyn Manson is really a role model when it comes to this. I am pretty sure he must have read The Satanic Witch! You project an image that matches what you feel is your 'true' self. And others will then project that back to you. Eventually...you become what you have created. Which is really the core meaning of becoming your own god in Satanism. It's a powerful feeling when you can manipulate men so easily. Yeah yeah. I know how that sounds. It's something you can control. Which makes you happier in the long run.

As for the clock. Well...it's a fun thing to dabble with. It's a general idea. And when we really dig deep in it..it actually does work. Though we might not be able to see deeper into people tor really understand that. I think it helps when you are generally trying to get to know someone. As when they show the diagram of a large masculine man..though inside at the core he's a feminine woman. It makes sense to me. But that takes a bit more experience to play with it.



I, personally am a classic 6 o' clock(with leanings toward the 7 mark). And I've cultivated myself to this even more so. Pulling out of me those classic 6 elements. I would thus be compatible with a classic 12 male. But the male I am with would be more between a 12 and 3. Which still works because when I see that I could be a 7, the opposite comes into contact with 12-3 anyways.

Anyways...I am glad you found the book helpful. And yes, it's a very pragmatic book. No mumbo jumbo. And though LaVey has been known to be a sort of misogynist..I wouldn't take advice about how to interact from men..from anything but. He's simply telling the truth!

[Witcher]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

How much prejudice do you deal with because of your path? Does it bother you or do you like having something unique to identify with regardless of what people think?

[Medusa]

Re: Ave Satanas (the Ask a Satanist thread)

[quote author=frankophonic link=topic=108.msg27840#msg27840 date=1294667680]
How much prejudice do you deal with because of your path? Does it bother you or do you like having something unique to identify with regardless of what people think?
[/quote]
None really. And no, I don't hide I am a Satanist. Nor do I wear pentagrams on my head to draw attention to it. Two answers though. One pertains to on-line and one pertains to real world.

On-line. I have been on numerous forums. From Fundamentalist Christian,Fundamentalist Muslim,Agnostic,Hard Atheist,Interfaith, Pagan, Satanist. On all I have gained friends and friendly on-line people. I have also gained a few who have systematically attacked me. But not because I was a Satanist per say (since I've been attacked on Satanic boards as well) but because I am a loud mouth obnoxious bitch with an opinion that is usually very unsafe in thought. But my penache for gab and a skin as thick is ademantium, I am able to navigate this internet world with still much fun and gusto! I am usually the cat with the mouse..and not the other way around. I get into debates constantly. None really ever have to do with my religion. Probably because my religion can be found in all religions to some extent. And that either scares the shit out of you...or not. Most poeple will agree with some basic principals of Satanism. It's not like some dude is gonna be like 'how dare you have self responsibility!' My Satanism is known where it is relevant. On music sites it's not the top thing I talk about etc. But on religious sites? It's really more of talking to others about their beliefs then them talking about mine. There's is vastly more interesting than mine. I have no deities, rituals, HARD LAWS. It's pretty low key in the scheme of things.

Now as for real life? I have never been treated with prejudice over this. My friends know who and what I am. I have both Christian and non Christian friends...from strong belief to not so sure. I picked them. So I would never pick people who didn't accept me. In my work life, my co-workers know who and what I am..in the work limitation scheme of things. They know I am a Satanist. And I won't lie...those who are friendly with me never really talk about it. And those who don't quite..well they have a fear of me. And I enjoy that. I have cultivated that persona long and hard. And it serves its purposes. My customers don't know. Why would they? All they know about me is I am a friendly waitress.

Do I like having something unique? I think honestly it's neutral. It doesn't benefit me. I have no need to be a 'special dark snowflake'. But I am not a group person by any means. So I am comfortable in having a belief system that is individual. I have no need for outside support in my belief system to strengthen me. I don't shun that need. I bet it feels great to be in a community. I just..rather be outside of it. It's my level.