Can emotion strengthen prayer?

[jcaternolo]

I read a story where someone was being bullied, and had a hard life. One day, he put all of his emotion into a prayer for a friend, and right after he finished his prayer, he heard a voice say "hello". He said hello back, and that night, he found his new friend in a dream, and they've become inseparable ever since. Now, whether this being is a tulpa, a spirit, an angel, a servitor, etc, is unknown, but he was able to shapeshift, changing from a male stallion to an altered version of Pinkie Pie from MLP. So I'm inclined to believe that it was a tulpa who answered his prayer. But tulpas normally take 1-6 months to achieve full sentience and become fully vocal.

My question is, does emotion really affect prayer? Also, if I had a group of people do a group prayer where we all focused all our despair, energy, love, etc into one powerful group prayer, could we achieve powerful results, as opposed to a normal, individual prayer? Because, I want to create a goddess based on a popular character, so she can help this world. And I read that anything that is worshiped, prayed to, served, or becomes popular enough can become a godform if it was an egregore. Sounds crazy, but I kinda thought the same thing about tulpas, but I'm being proven wrong every day.

[nbdy]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

I don't know about all the rest, but I'd suggest the possibility that emotion is the prayer ... unless you honestly believe English is the native tongue of the Universe ...

[jcaternolo]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Basically, what I have in mind is this. A truly heartfelt, sincere prayer shouted with all of my strength, heart, and emotion.

[ChainLightning]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Emotions affect prayers. They can even INfect them.

As far as screaming, strength or any of that jazz? That sounds unnecessarily pubescent.

The only things that mean something to prayer or spellwork, aside from whatever 'nonsense' one wants to ascribe to, are thoughts and feelings. Your heart and mind. Everything else is peripheral, at best.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

My question is, does emotion really affect prayer?

Yes.

Also, if I had a group of people do a group prayer where we all focused all our despair, energy, love, etc into one powerful group prayer, could we achieve powerful results, as opposed to a normal, individual prayer?

Theoretically, yes.

But in practice it's not just as simple as everyone getting together and wishing really, really hard. Each individual person needs to be able to control and crystalise their emotions well enough to keep it clear and foremost. Everyone in the group needs to be working for the same goal, with no ulterior motives or underlying doubts or issues, which is actually a lot harder than it sounds. And most importantly, there needs to be a skilled practitioner who can control, harness and direct all that energy.

Because, I want to create a goddess based on a popular character, so she can help this world. And I read that anything that is worshiped, prayed to, served, or becomes popular enough can become a godform if it was an egregore. Sounds crazy, but I kinda thought the same thing about tulpas, but I'm being proven wrong every day.

Yes, you can create a servitor or a group egregore that can gain power and reach something similar to god status. BUT... and this is a pretty big 'but'... it literally takes thousands upon thousands of people pouring their devotion and belief into an entity over a number of years to get it to that point. One person can't do it alone. One group or coven can't do it alone. A skilled magician can create a powerful servitor that can become autonomous and self sufficient, to a point, but it takes skill and planning and has a high risk of backfiring if you don't do it right. Even if one did have the skill for this, evolving the servitor into something more powerful would not be easy.

As for pop culture icons... a lot of these (particularly anime ones) already exist as group egregores. I think it's entirely possible that in the next hundred years or so we may see some of these evolve into god status. There are some who claim that they are already there.

[jcaternolo]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Yes.



Theoretically, yes.

But in practice it's not just as simple as everyone getting together and wishing really, really hard. Each individual person needs to be able to control and crystalise their emotions well enough to keep it clear and foremost. Everyone in the group needs to be working for the same goal, with no ulterior motives or underlying doubts or issues, which is actually a lot harder than it sounds. And most importantly, there needs to be a skilled practitioner who can control, harness and direct all that energy.



Yes, you can create a servitor or a group egregore that can gain power and reach something similar to god status. BUT... and this is a pretty big 'but'... it literally takes thousands upon thousands of people pouring their devotion and belief into an entity over a number of years to get it to that point. One person can't do it alone. One group or coven can't do it alone. A skilled magician can create a powerful servitor that can become autonomous and self sufficient, to a point, but it takes skill and planning and has a high risk of backfiring if you don't do it right. Even if one did have the skill for this, evolving the servitor into something more powerful would not be easy.

As for pop culture icons... a lot of these (particularly anime ones) already exist as group egregores. I think it's entirely possible that in the next hundred years or so we may see some of these evolve into god status. There are some who claim that they are already there.

About how much faster would chaos magick make the process go? I'm interested in trying it (I realize I have to train my mind first). Also, the goddess I want to create is based on Princess Celestia. I think there are already billions who like the character, so she's already popular with billions. Although most wouldn't consider her a god, but a princess. So I'm not sure how much that will help with devotion. A chaosite told me that she would only need about 20 followers max to achieve godhood, although that's probably with the chaos magick ritual. To be honest, I'm kinda tempted to just give the whole thing up, because there are plenty of other deities anyway, who can do the same things, but the possibility of Goddess Celestia is just too enticing to pass up (I'm being serious, I'm a diehard Celestia fan. And her religion would be one that I could very easily pick up). I'm just afraid that if I start praying to her, I might end up just making a Celestia tulpa, instead of a Celestia egregore, and I want to make a goddess who can help everyone.

[Gleb]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Emotions have a great deal in prayer, magic stuff and... well... almost everything I know.
In everything is different. But sometimes, the emotions mustn't take hold over the body. There are some reasons.
First, what one is doing (prayer, ritual etc'...) may fail to succeed.
Second, the person might hurt him/herself by not balancing the emotions.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

About how much faster would chaos magick make the process go?

It's not the style of magick that is used, but the skill of the practitioner. Chaos magick is just a set of techniques that can be used, like any other style of magick. It's not inherently better, faster or more powerful than any other set of techniques, although it is one of the paths that tends towards using pop culture icons and creating servitors and/or egregores. So in that sense it would be a good path to look into if that's what you wish to achieve. Chaos magick is not for everyone though... it takes a certain sort of belief structure and personal skillset to do it well.

I'm interested in trying it (I realize I have to train my mind first). Also, the goddess I want to create is based on Princess Celestia. I think there are already billions who like the character, so she's already popular with billions. Although most wouldn't consider her a god, but a princess. So I'm not sure how much that will help with devotion. A chaosite told me that she would only need about 20 followers max to achieve godhood, although that's probably with the chaos magick ritual. To be honest, I'm kinda tempted to just give the whole thing up, because there are plenty of other deities anyway, who can do the same things, but the possibility of Goddess Celestia is just too enticing to pass up (I'm being serious, I'm a diehard Celestia fan. And her religion would be one that I could very easily pick up). I'm just afraid that if I start praying to her, I might end up just making a Celestia tulpa, instead of a Celestia egregore, and I want to make a goddess who can help everyone.

I don't know who that is, but if she's an anime character with a huge fan base, then she probably already exists as an egregore.

One thing to consider with this is that you can't use a pop culture icon to form a deity of your own liking... they already have their own personality and inclinations. A group egregore is formed based on the character and it's existing personality... you can't change that without changing the character itself. So when you talk about creating a goddess who can help everyone... well you have to think about whether that is actually what this character would do. You also have to consider the fact that pup culture icons generally exist within their own cosmos, which means that bringing them out of their created world and into this one can be out of context and difficult for them.

I would recommend that you do some in depth research into communities who work with pop culture icons. Join up with one and learn from them... there are also a few published books dealing with the subject. Taylor Ellwood is one that comes to mind.

[MaskedOne]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

I don't know who that is, but if she's an anime character with a huge fan base, then she probably already exists as an egregore.

Children's cartoon actually but yes, Celestia should have a pretty well-sized fanbase. The show has a f***-huge fanbase. Celestia is well liked, I don't know how popular she is compared to the rest of the setting since my knowledge of MLP:FiM is all second hand from what I hear when it invades SpaceBattles*.

* As a point of popularity, this show designed for young children has mounted a semi-successful invasion of a site where these

Please, do not compare SB to the other, less ambitious, more grounded, forums out there. The goal is to find out how soon the Milky Way can be used as a shuriken against our foes. Nothing less will be receivable.

Spacebattles Peace. Noun: See "reloading time."

are beloved axioms.

[jcaternolo]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Hmm, maybe I'll try to create an original goddess who embodies Celestia's traits, along with Luna's. And some traits from some of the existing deities. Although, an original character would be much harder to bring about, than a worldwide known, popular character.

[Ektor]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Look, if you believe MLP contains depictions of deity-like creatures, it's fine; no one can tell you your beliefs are not valid or even less valid than their own. But you sound really trollish when you say those stuff. I'm actually starting to think you're trying to troll this forum with that, I don't like it.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Look, if you believe MLP contains depictions of deity-like creatures, it's fine; no one can tell you your beliefs are not valid or even less valid than their own. But you sound really trollish when you say those stuff. I'm actually starting to think you're trying to troll this forum with that, I don't like it.

There is a well established subset of paganism that works with pop culture egregors and 'deities'. Factor chaotes into the mix and it's actually not an unusual thing to believe or attempt to do. Whether or not we agree with the belief is largely irrelevant. There are several members here at PF who work with pop culture entities.

[Ektor]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

Yeah, I'm completely fine with that, I'm just not used to it and the way it's put sounds off to me.

[Medusa]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

You know what affects prayer?
Actions.

[nbdy]

Re: Can emotion strengthen prayer?

You know what affects prayer?
Actions.

hehe. Reminds of a joke I loved about a woman praying to win the lottery. She prayed long and hard every night, weeping and sleeping on the wet pillow yearning for the windfall she was certain to gain. Finally, a voice responded: "Meet me halfway. Buy a ticket."