afterlife question?

[loststarshine]

What are your views on the afterlife?


How do you feel about the afterlife of someone who has commited sucide?

Does it effect anothers after life?

If the person was of a pagan belief how would their dieties feel?


Open for discussion im interested and seeing other peoples views on this subject. Knowing very few pagans in real life i typicaly hear a christian viewpoint.

[MaskedOne]

Re: afterlife question?

1) That I'll worry about it later

2) Hopefully they find peace.

3) Presuming a conscious afterlife involving contact with loved ones, yes. Otherwise, no.

4) Varies based on deity.

I suspect (so not interested in researching it atm) that the hard-line anti-suicide approach from Christianity is based in an ideological struggle with various splinter sects active in early church history. I believe that in recent history various priests (and hopefully higher) have been practicing the time honored Catholic tradition of splitting hairs very thinly to find ways to say that "No, suicide to escape seemingly unbearable pain/anguish/depression does not equal express ride to hell" without flat out saying "the early Church contained a number of f-ing morons and no the LoH isn't handing out eternal damnation for suicide because that would mean he's a sadistic a****** and Catholic doctrine explicitly denies that conception of him."

Of course, Catholic doctrine can be slow to modify (it takes time to work out all the hair splitting necessary to change doctrine and then say with a straight face that Catholic doctrine is not changing at all, merely being clarified) and I have no idea which other sects have already jumped past them vs which will cry "HERESY!!!" at the very thought.

[loststarshine]

Re: afterlife question?

1) That I'll worry about it later

2) Hopefully they find peace.

3) Presuming a conscious afterlife involving contact with loved ones, yes. Otherwise, no.

4) Varies based on deity.

I suspect (so not interested in researching it atm) that the hard-line anti-suicide approach from Christianity is based in an ideological struggle with various splinter sects active in early church history. I believe that in recent history various priests (and hopefully higher) have been practicing the time honored Catholic tradition of splitting hairs very thinly to find ways to say that "No, suicide to escape seemingly unbearable pain/anguish/depression does not equal express ride to hell" without flat out saying "the early Church contained a number of f-ing morons and no the LoH isn't handing out eternal damnation for suicide because that would mean he's a sadistic a****** and Catholic doctrine explicitly denies that conception of him."

Of course, Catholic doctrine can be slow to modify (it takes time to work out all the hair splitting necessary to change doctrine and then say with a straight face that Catholic doctrine is not changing at all, merely being clarified) and I have no idea which other sects have already jumped past them vs which will cry "HERESY!!!" at the very thought.

Thank you. A loved one commited sucide a year ago he was a pagan....i would be lying if i said it didnt rattle me with questions all grief counseling was from a christian viewpoint neither he or i followed this path.

[monsno_leedra]

Re: afterlife question?

What are your views on the afterlife?

I personally think there is both an afterlife and a prelife. But then I also believe in reincarnation as part of the cyclic nature of life.

How do you feel about the afterlife of someone who has commited sucide?

I am sworn to Hekate and one aspect of her archaic practice was suicide created restless dead. Those who were cursed to roam and haunt the land and could be commanded to perform tasks by curse tablets and such until they were given proper ritual / ceremony to cross over. Then basically driven like sheep or dogs before their task master when she roamed the land collecting those spirit for whatever purpose she desired or punishment she would inflict.

Not an afterlife that I would want to experience I can tell you.

Does it effect anothers after life?

I don't think so. though the way they live their life could affect / effect their own afterlife.

If the person was of a pagan belief how would their dieties feel?

I think it would depend upon what god / goddess they worshiped and to what degree they were claimed by said god / goddess. The gods / goddesses I am sworn and bound to would not take kindly to their followers doing so. They may strike you down in a heart beat for any offense or take you when they decide it is time but to give up and give in is an offense to them in my opinion.

[Amadi]

Re: afterlife question?

I never really cared about the afterlife until I read a theory that really struck a chord with me, summing it up 1) I'd say spirits transcend your physical form and once you die you go to a place (The Summerland/Heaven etc.) and you meet with everything that's had a significant effect on your life while you wait for those still living to meet with you, finally when all matters have been settled and your goodbyes said you reincarnate.
i generally prefer this theory over the others because essentially nothing is ever finished with someone, I believe I'll meet everyone again one day and we'll be able to have one last laugh about times gone bye, be it one of my Pets, an older relative, a good friend, rival or some shopkeeper down the road.

2) They shouldn't receive any harsh treatment etc. They'll have a bad time explaining why they did it and it'll be a long time waiting to begin anew but I don't see anything 'wrong' about Suicide, if your life is really that bad that you think the only option you have is ending it then who am I to judge

3) Yeah, everyone gets to have a merry old chat.

4) Entirely depends on the deity and relationship with the pagan

[nbdy]

Re: afterlife question?

For me there is just life, and categorizing it as before/during/after imposes upon it a temporality that has more to do with the way our brains work than with the way life, in a cosmic sense, is. Honestly, the fact that there is life rather than nothing completely blows me away.

So the questions seem to be about death and consequences. Who really knows? I suspect that both experiences are what we have made of them; we do seem to find the things we seek, whether consciously or not.

[loststarshine]

Re: afterlife question?

For me there is just life, and categorizing it as before/during/after imposes upon it a temporality that has more to do with the way our brains work than with the way life, in a cosmic sense, is. Honestly, the fact that there is life rather than nothing completely blows me away.
.

It is not so much consquences as does sucide henders a souls way into reincarnation for example. Does the soul carry that negativity into their next life? Or does the sucide cleanse one of the negativity clouding the soul prior I apologize for the morbid subject matter I am eager here thoughts and view beyond the christian view of hell and damnation.
I

[B. de Corbin]

Re: afterlife question?

What are your views on the afterlife?

It's another name for being dead.

How do you feel about the afterlife of someone who has commited sucide?

They're dead.

Does it effect anothers after life?

The living suffer.

If the person was of a pagan belief how would their dieties feel?

If they are dead, their deities are also dead.

[Torey]

Re: afterlife question?

In my beliefs, dead is dead - and "how it happened" doesn't mean anything in regards to afterlife consequences.

I believe in an afterlife, but I believe that it's far more complex than simply one designated place where every departed spirit hangs out for eternity.

I feel that the loved ones the person left behind will suffer emotionally.

As for how that person's deities would feel - that I can't answer as I can't presume to know what any deity might feel or do in a given situation.

[nbdy]

Re: afterlife question?

It is not so much consquences as does sucide henders a souls way into reincarnation for example. Does the soul carry that negativity into their next life? Or does the sucide cleanse one of the negativity clouding the soul prior I apologize for the morbid subject matter I am eager here thoughts and view beyond the christian view of hell and damnation.
I

See LunarHarvest's funny posted page 6 here: http://www.paganforum.com/showthread...or/page6&p=332

[Ophidia]

Re: afterlife question?

I'm a reincarnationist. I don't follow any particular version of it, though. Tibetan Buddhism's system is rather convoluted, as is Hindu's. I've fleshed out my own eclectic cosmology.

In the beginning, we all come from the Source, the Great Mystery, what I see as an amorphous cloud of consciousness. Every once in awhile, the Source determines that it wants a new experience, so a piece of it coalesces and inhabits a living being. Like being like, these soul fragments tend to gravitate towards others who have had similar experiences, or parts of itself that it recognizes from before it became a living being. So these fragments of the Great Mystery go about life, gathering information and experiences and connections to other living beings (which is where the connection between twins/triplets/etc. comes from, and soul mates and twin flames and all that other New Age lovey-dovey stuff - and those people that you feel you've known forever even though you've just met, or different people who show up over & over again in your life).

Once we've gained all we can in one lifetime, the living being dies and the soul fragment drifts around. Sometimes, if it's full enough, it returns to the Source to share its experiences. If it's not ready, it inhabits yet another living being. And another, and another, learning and experiencing and connecting more and more, until it's had all it can have in an infinite number of lifetimes. Which is where 'old souls' and the ultimate experience of enlightenment/nirvana come from. Sometimes the fragments get lost - those are ghosts. They forget that they are part of the Source, or they get too attached to their latest life, and won't return or move on to another life. And sometimes, the soul fragments never make it to a brand new living being, and other times the soul fragment isn't substantial enough to sustain a living being, or they get further fragmented and torn and worn through abuse, trauma, or a problem with the body of the living being and they never make it back to the Source.

Within the framework of my cosmology, suicide is just another experience a fragment of the Source may need or want to experience. Sometimes the soul fragments inhabiting family members need to experience the suicide of someone close to them, or there may be a greater purpose to it. I think the living being maintains its own free will and the soul fragment basically gets drawn to the new life that will be most likely to experience what the fragment needs or wants to experience. The fragment is just a ride-along, though, unless the Source has something specific in mind for a living being.There's a vague sense of predetermination there I suppose.

[loststarshine]

Re: afterlife question?

I'm a reincarnationist. I don't follow any particular version of it, though. Tibetan Buddhism's system is rather convoluted, as is Hindu's. I've fleshed out my own eclectic cosmology.

In the beginning, we all come from the Source, the Great Mystery, what I see as an amorphous cloud of consciousness. Every once in awhile, the Source determines that it wants a new experience, so a piece of it coalesces and inhabits a living being. Like being like, these soul fragments tend to gravitate towards others who have had similar experiences, or parts of itself that it recognizes from before it became a living being. So these fragments of the Great Mystery go about life, gathering information and experiences and connections to other living beings (which is where the connection between twins/triplets/etc. comes from, and soul mates and twin flames and all that other New Age lovey-dovey stuff - and those people that you feel you've known forever even though you've just met, or different people who show up over & over again in your life).

Once we've gained all we can in one lifetime, the living being dies and the soul fragment drifts around. Sometimes, if it's full enough, it returns to the Source to share its experiences. If it's not ready, it inhabits yet another living being. And another, and another, learning and experiencing and connecting more and more, until it's had all it can have in an infinite number of lifetimes. Which is where 'old souls' and the ultimate experience of enlightenment/nirvana come from. Sometimes the fragments get lost - those are ghosts. They forget that they are part of the Source, or they get too attached to their latest life, and won't return or move on to another life. And sometimes, the soul fragments never make it to a brand new living being, and other times the soul fragment isn't substantial enough to sustain a living being, or they get further fragmented and torn and worn through abuse, trauma, or a problem with the body of the living being and they never make it back to the Source.

Within the framework of my cosmology, suicide is just another experience a fragment of the Source may need or want to experience. Sometimes the soul fragments inhabiting family members need to experience the suicide of someone close to them, or there may be a greater purpose to it. I think the living being maintains its own free will and the soul fragment basically gets drawn to the new life that will be most likely to experience what the fragment needs or wants to experience. The fragment is just a ride-along, though, unless the Source has something specific in mind for a living being.There's a vague sense of predetermination there I suppose.

Thank you very much... im at a lost for words this means alot to me once again thank you

- - - Updated - - -

See LunarHarvest's funny posted page 6 here: http://www.paganforum.com/showthread...or/page6&p=332

That picture made me laugh so much i want it on a shirt

[Cobra]

Re: afterlife question?

What are your views on the afterlife?

I believe in one life. My belief is that there is a spirit world, or world of kami, connected with but apart from ours. So when a person dies, their soul will become an ancestral/family kami. One could watch over their family, watch over a specific area that was important or closely connected to them in life, or be closer to kami.

How do you feel about the afterlife of someone who has commited sucide?

Does it effect anothers after life?

It's not affected.

If the person was of a pagan belief how would their dieties feel?

Welcoming, I'd hope, and glad that their troubles were over. Possibly disappointed that they could not make something greater, though. I'm not really one to say here.

[Louisvillian]

Re: afterlife question?

What are your views on the afterlife?

Combination of the traditional Hellenic view and reincarnation. When we die, our souls are comported to the abode of the dead, guided by psychopomps. We may or may not be judged in the afterlife, but if we are it is by our peers and not the gods. I think that, after a time, we reincarnate. I believe that it is possible, and desirable, for an individual to break the cycle of death and rebirth, and join the heroic and the righteous in a blessed land of always-summer.

As far as suicide: entirely circumstantial.

[thalassa]

Re: afterlife question?

I believe that death is irrelevant to how we live our lives. What happens after we die is life's great mystery... I think its incredibly sad that someone decides to take their own life, because ultimately, I think you only get one shot, and when you die, that's it. I don't really believe in an afterlife, beyond being recycled physically and energetically. Regardless, I would hope that someone so troubled in life that they feel the need to kill themselves would find peace in their death...and any deity that would judge someone for that choice isn't worthy of worship.